Pico De Orizaba (18,500 ft in Mexico) info needed

[Scott P]

Cut and paste of my Diamox story:

In January 2007 we went to climb some of the big volcanoes in Ecuador. I ended up getting food poisoning in the Houston Airport (USA) on the way down. I was bed ridden for several days once reaching Ecuador. Because of this, I missed our first two acclimatization climbs (but still did some of the others). I was worried about AMS and not being as acclimatized as the rest of the group since I missed the two climbs, so I popped Diamox before climbing Cotopaxi. I also drank a lot of water since I knew that hydration can improve acclimatization and Diamox can dry you out more since it makes you urinate more frequently.

Anyway, I peed a lot. A whole lot. It is an unpleasant side effect of the Diamox. Anyway, we were staying on the upper floor of the Cotopaxi hut. In order to try and not wake anyone I went to go find a pee bottle. I found a 2 liter bottle and cut the top off to use as a pee bottle. After s few hours, I filled the bottle full. Unfortunately, I also ended up spilling the full bottle. I didn't want to wake everyone up and it was dark and I didn't have anything to clean it up with, so I decided to leave it and clean it up when we were to wake up.

A few hours later I heard stirring downstairs and people speaking different languages. I assumed that they were getting a head start on the mountain and starting to pack up their gear early. Not soon after I heard in plain English WHAT THE @#$%, THE @#$#-ING CIELING'S DRIPPING! Since my wife was planning on reading her novel in the hut instead of climbing the peak I woke her up and quietly told her I needed her shirt. Kim: What? Me: I need your shirt; please take it off. Kim: Why? Me: I need to clean up my pee. Kim: What? Why not use your own shirt? Me: I need my shirt to climb the mountain. You can just wear your jacket. She took off her shirt and gave it to me and I cleaned it up. I never told anyone else in the hut what happened.

Anyway, I don't think I'll ever use Diamox again.

[kaiman]

Cut and paste of my Diamox story:

In January 2007 we went to climb some of the big volcanoes in Ecuador. I ended up getting food poisoning in the Houston Airport (USA) on the way down. I was bed ridden for several days once reaching Ecuador. Because of this, I missed our first two acclimatization climbs (but still did some of the others). I was worried about AMS and not being as acclimatized as the rest of the group since I missed the two climbs, so I popped Diamox before climbing Cotopaxi. I also drank a lot of water since I knew that hydration can improve acclimatization and Diamox can dry you out more since it makes you urinate more frequently.

Anyway, I peed a lot. A whole lot. It is an unpleasant side effect of the Diamox. Anyway, we were staying on the upper floor of the Cotopaxi hut. In order to try and not wake anyone I went to go find a pee bottle. I found a 2 liter bottle and cut the top off to use as a pee bottle. After s few hours, I filled the bottle full. Unfortunately, I also ended up spilling the full bottle. I didn't want to wake everyone up and it was dark and I didn't have anything to clean it up with, so I decided to leave it and clean it up when we were to wake up.

A few hours later I heard stirring downstairs and people speaking different languages. I assumed that they were getting a head start on the mountain and starting to pack up their gear early. Not soon after I heard in plain English WHAT THE @#$%, THE @#$#-ING CIELING'S DRIPPING! Since my wife was planning on reading her novel in the hut instead of climbing the peak I woke her up and quietly told her I needed her shirt. Kim: What? Me: I need your shirt; please take it off. Kim: Why? Me: I need to clean up my pee. Kim: What? Why not use your own shirt? Me: I need my shirt to climb the mountain. You can just wear your jacket. She took off her shirt and gave it to me and I cleaned it up. I never told anyone else in the hut what happened.

Anyway, I don't think I'll ever use Diamox again.

Oh man that sucks Scott!

I've never used Diamox in the mountains, but did take a daily dose of Ginko for about a month before going to Mexico last year. Other than a headache on Itza (which I attribute to going from Amecameca at 8,500 feet to the Refugio at 15,700 in about 8 hours and which went away with Advil), I didn't have any issues. Before our climb we did spend a day at 9,000 feet at the pyramids north of Mexico City and also almost 15 hours at the hut at Orizaba (14,000 feet) before summiting the next day.

To the poster worried about getting AMS in Mexico (Corduroy Calves) - there is not much you can do about it but take your time, acclimatize, drink lots of water, and hope you don't have any genetic predispositions for altitude sickness. I understand your concerns about time and money prepping for the trip, but Mexico is relatively inexpensive and the perfect place to see how you will do at altitude. You may or may not summit for other reasons than altitude sickness, that's just part of the mountaineering game. Besides, it's not like you're spending $50,000 on an Everest permit or $3000 to get there.

Just my 2 cents,

Kai

[speth]

Cut and paste of my Diamox story:

In January 2007 we went to climb some of the big volcanoes in Ecuador. I ended up getting food poisoning in the Houston Airport (USA) on the way down. I was bed ridden for several days once reaching Ecuador. Because of this, I missed our first two acclimatization climbs (but still did some of the others). I was worried about AMS and not being as acclimatized as the rest of the group since I missed the two climbs, so I popped Diamox before climbing Cotopaxi. I also drank a lot of water since I knew that hydration can improve acclimatization and Diamox can dry you out more since it makes you urinate more frequently.

Anyway, I peed a lot. A whole lot. It is an unpleasant side effect of the Diamox. Anyway, we were staying on the upper floor of the Cotopaxi hut. In order to try and not wake anyone I went to go find a pee bottle. I found a 2 liter bottle and cut the top off to use as a pee bottle. After s few hours, I filled the bottle full. Unfortunately, I also ended up spilling the full bottle. I didn't want to wake everyone up and it was dark and I didn't have anything to clean it up with, so I decided to leave it and clean it up when we were to wake up.

A few hours later I heard stirring downstairs and people speaking different languages. I assumed that they were getting a head start on the mountain and starting to pack up their gear early. Not soon after I heard in plain English WHAT THE @#$%, THE @#$#-ING CIELING'S DRIPPING! Since my wife was planning on reading her novel in the hut instead of climbing the peak I woke her up and quietly told her I needed her shirt. Kim: What? Me: I need your shirt; please take it off. Kim: Why? Me: I need to clean up my pee. Kim: What? Why not use your own shirt? Me: I need my shirt to climb the mountain. You can just wear your jacket. She took off her shirt and gave it to me and I cleaned it up. I never told anyone else in the hut what happened.

Anyway, I don't think I'll ever use Diamox again.

That is definitely a nightmare story.

I took Diamox as a precaution for Orizaba - just made sure to drink a lot of water and I felt fine. It was probably overkill for Orizaba, but might be a good idea for other peaks and endeavors in South America. Your mountain may vary.

[Monster5]

-I would not recommend taking any drugs until knowing how your body reacts to altitude and if drugs are in fact necessary. Like Kaiman said, Mexico is a great, relatively low commitment spot to test it. Even if your body reacts poorly to altitude, consider a more relaxed pace and schedule rather than drugs and their inherent risks.

-The Labyrinth and upper Orizaba slopes were pretty icy when we were there around T-giving a few years ago. Conditions change, but in ours, there'd be a near-nil chance of self arresting in a fall (perhaps not a slip). It would be ideal to work on cramponing technique. Get comfortable on low-moderate slopes and avoid poor technique which may cause a fall in the first place. Objective hazards on route are near nil.

-Tack on Izta. The views are better than Orizaba.

-In terms of technical difficulty, I'd say doing a moderate couloir up a Sawatch 14er in non-slog conditions (read: icy) would be similar. The angle doesn't break 40 deg on route. The hardest part is probably descending the Labyrinth, though that can vary anywhere from dry recently to slog snow to icy. Face in and front point down if necessary.

-Secor's guide is out of date due to glacial retreat. The information is cool from a historical perspective, but the routes are significantly different. The TRs on here are much more useful.

[timf]

I sincerely suspect that one's ability to acclimatize at elevation has a lot more to do with genetics than with training.

This is what worries me the most about our trip. I've spent a lot of time getting in shape and I'd hate to get up there and have issues with the elevation. Life at 14K is fine and don't have any issues; I'll just try to stay hydrated and hope for the best.

We're in the same boat partner. I think our plan to sleep at Piedre for 2 nights with 2 acclimation hikes will help us tremendously inching close to 16K' will give us a good indicator how we'll be higher up. I suspect most people that have tried Orizaba have only gone as high as 14433' prior to. Communicating how we're doing along the way will be key. I might get Diamox next month just to see how I react. Otherwise part of my daily routine has already been to drink a gallon a day of water and not hold back during ascent. So I'm right there with ya. I'm cover 180 floors of stairs in 45min which is nothing compared to the 20 something all stars here, but for me, that's pretty good. It tells be nothing (unfortunately) how I'll function at over 18000. So little nervous but excited to!

[SnowAlien]

I took Diamox on Orizaba after I was slow at acclimating (terrible headache that won't go away, dry mouth, thirsty, woke up 10 times the 1st night at the hut). Next morning woke up to the sounds of a tentmate throwing up in the latrine (she had to be taken down later that day). I said "screw it, I don't want to get really sick" and took 1/5 pill of the Diamox. Felt so much better almost immediately. 2nd acclimation hike went well and I felt fine on the summit day after another 1/2 of the pill. Stayed on the summit almost 2 hours waiting for the rest of the group and didn't have any lingering effects afterwards, except maybe a slight headache and overall fatigue after a climb. Diamox side effects I've noticed included: increased peeing and numbness/tingling in fingers. Was totally worth it to me, especially after seeing several people at the hut get sick and taken down. Decided not to take anything for Ixta a couple days later, and did just fine (presumably acclimation finally kicked in).

[timf]

I also hope to sleep on top of Cupid 2 days before we leave to hopefully help a little bit. I believe though that I might not be able to leave my car at Loveland Pass overnight so might have to be dropped off there.

[jbchalk]

I'd definitely have Diamox with you whether you use it or not. Case in point with Natalie's experience mentioned above. I have used it preventatively before on Orizaba in 2004 and on Aconcagua in 2006 and besides the normal side effects, it seemed to work well. However, I really just had it with me in case of emergencies on every other high altitude trip since. It was especially helpful to have as an "extra strength" form of ibuprofen on Everest 2010 as it allowed my wife and I to get rid of our headaches our first night at Camp 1 (19,500'), headaches which normal ibuprofen didn't touch. We didn't use Diamox the rest of the Everest climb except for that once night and boy did it "save" our night.

[I Man]

-I would not recommend taking any drugs until knowing how your body reacts to altitude and if drugs are in fact necessary.

Agreed. No disrespect to others on here with more experience and skill than me, but the whole mindset of starting with performance enhancing drugs before you even test yourself is bad news. Like many in CO, Orizaba was my first experience with high altitude. It wasn't so bad - everyone on my team made the summit on the second day of our trip - that is very common.

I would never consider taking performance enhancing drugs (Diamox, Oxygen, etc...), but that is a personal choice and one that you should make for yourself. The exception for me would be to take Dex in a life saving situation - however, I have been to extreme altitude and in very committing situations at altitude without Dex.

Maybe I am lucky - this s**t is all genetic. Some people (and no, not just Ueli & Killian) can run up Denali in a matter of days, while others will take weeks and barely make it up the peak. My chosen style of climbing often has me way above 14k with minimal acclimatizing. Of course, I've seen one of my best friends come pretty close to the edge because of this style.

In my humble, inexperienced opinion, below 6000m is not really that serious and can often be done in a short trip. Grab the summit and return down before your body really even knows it is at altitude. Sleeping/camping is the real hard part - and you don't need to do that on Orizaba. Above 6000m gets really intense, again in my own limited experience. Having been only to 6768m, I can't imagine what it feel like to go above 7000m, 75000m, 8000m in my chosen style - but I am sure as hell planning to find out

Have fun and don't overthink this. Orizaba is a wonderful choice for a first international high altitude climb.

[akoller]

I took diamox and didn't like it. It made me feel anxious and jittery and I even ended up having a stress dream about getting altitude sickness - when I woke up the diamox had worn off and I felt fine. I second the others who say you should test how your body reacts to it.

In my opinion a reason to take diamox is not to "enhance your performance" but because if you are with a group of people and one person gets altitude sickness it can compromise everyone else's summit bid.

[mchriss]

OK, I'm in.
Just got a ticket to MEX. Reserved a spot with SummitOrizaba. 1/16 through 1/24.
That's the limit of my plans for now.

chris

[CorduroyCalves]

OK, I'm in.
Just got a ticket to MEX. Reserved a spot with SummitOrizaba. 1/16 through 1/24.
That's the limit of my plans for now.

chris

Welcome aboard, Chris! Feel free to PM me or timf and perhaps the three of us can get together for a drink/bite to eat and figure things out.