Twin Thumbs Pass w/ full backpack

[Phill the Thrill]

I'm planning a Weminuche trip the first weekend in October. There are 2 objectives: 1. Help my friend climb Sunlight/Windom (he has already climbed the Eolus Group but we'll do that too, time permitting) and 2. I'd like to climb Pigeon/Turret and explore the Ruby Lake basin. We will have 4 days/3 nights, so not a lot of extra time.

I've studied maps/routes/trip reports, and it appears that the best way to link the Chicago Basin 14ers with Pigeon/Turret is via Twin Thumbs Pass (13,200 ft.). For you seasoned Weminuche backpackers, is it better to go to Chicago Basin first (taking the afternoon train from Silverton to Needleton), then descend from Twin Thumbs Pass to NoName/Ruby basins, or vice versa, and ascend the Twin Thumbs Pass from the Ruby Basin?

Keeping in mind that we will have our heavy multi-day backpacks, it seems perhaps easier to me to go Chicago 14ers, then Pigeon/Turret.

Any opinions or words of wisdom?

[snowypeaks]

I've done it both ways and prefer going through Chicago Basin first and then around to Ruby. That way the backside traverse is slightly descending rather than ascending and to me a bit easier. Given that the traverse is on the north side of Twin Thumbs, there may be some new snow around. Gorgeous country. Enjoy and have a safe trip!

[TomPierce]

I've done TT Pass 4 times, 3 CB>Ruby, 1 Ruby>CB. I found going from CB > Ruby far easier. Easier to gain the most altitude on a super highway trail like the one in CB, and I've always found it easier to routefind on tougher trails like Ruby going downhill (although Ruby has gotten noticeably easier IMO in the last 5 or so years).

Just my opinions, it'll go in either direction.

-Tom

[DArcyS]

If snow or ice is present, the terrain on the Ruby/north side may be hard/scary/dangerous without an ice axe and at least microspikes. In any case, don't expect a nice and easy class 1 trail on the north side of the pass. If you look at the gradient via Caltopo, you'll see it's relatively steep. And as Yogi might say, it's probably steeper when icy.

Also, you'd probably be hard pressed to make it to Ruby Lake taking the afternoon train out of Silverton with the sun setting a little after 7pm the first weekend in October. Your best option given these constraints is probably Chicago Basin, and even then you might find yourself racing the setting sun. I suppose some of this depends on your conditioning and weight of your pack, but for an October trip, it might be hard to go super-lite without being cold.

[Phill the Thrill]

Thanks everyone.

Yes, we'll bring ice axe/spikes at a minimum, and it's true the backpack will be a few pounds heavier this time of year. I think we'll head to Chicago Basin first. For one thing, I feel comfortable finding a campsite in the dark, if necessary, since I've been there twice before. So, our planned itinerary will look something like this:

Thursday - drive to Silverton, take train to Needleton, pack in to Chicago Basin.
Friday - pack up early am, hike to Twin Lakes, drop backpacks somewhere near Twin Lakes, climb Sunlight/Windom/Eolus/N. Eolus, pick up backpacks and head to upper Ruby Basin via Twin Thumbs Pass. Obviously, this is a long day. If we're short on time we may drop Eolus/N. Eolus (my friend has already climbed those).
Saturday - Pigeon/Turret, perhaps move camp closer to Ruby Lake at end of day.
Sunday - leave early enough to catch train at 11:15 am in Needleton.

That's a pretty aggressive schedule, but I think we can do it.

[TomPierce]

Phill:

Let me add a little more detail, hopefully helpful:

-On your hike up to CB: There's a nice little campsite on the left side of the trail at the junction with the NY Basin "trail." It's about halfway up to CB, near a stream junction as I recall. But you're right, lots of option when you get to CB, and at that time of the year you should have no problem getting a site.

-Descending off TT to Ruby: Be a bit careful on the initial descent down into the basin. Your goal is the arcing traverse to Ruby, the pass will be at about 10 o'clock to your left (noon being straight down valley from TT). The first 100 feet or so off TT is a bit steep, my recollection is there were small ledges to descender's left. Watch the footing, typical San Juan kitty litter all over. Don't want to overstate it, it's not a big deal or anything, just a slow tedious down climb for maybe 100', then it's just loose junk to hike through for another couple hundred yards. On the traverse over, just class 2-ish, maybe a few class 3 moves to get over a rock or two, but that's entirely dependent on the line you take. Not a big deal at all, there probably are photos in TR's here. Generally, the lower you descend into the valley, the easier it is, but it means more of a slog up and over to Ruby. Careful on the rock slabs higher up in the morning, I could see where they might get icy in October before the sun hits them.

-Ruby Basin is one of the most beautiful places in Colorado, enjoy. The exit out & down from the flat basin is generally on descender's right, and it's a bit bushwhacky at first, just find a line through the willows and stick with it. If you get off a trail, do the best you can to keep going, a few options in the willows. I found heading to a larger rock outcropping in the willows really helped me pick up the trail again when I was there alone last time. Once you are back on trail, note there are a couple of "saloon doors" in the woods where the trail isn't obvious unless you push through some branches. Not a big deal, just don't expect anything like CB's trail in Ruby . It's not that hard to find the trail once below the willows IMO, the Ruby trail has gotten easier over the years.

-Your exit camp: Note that once you make Ruby Lake on the descent, there are several great campsites near the lake's edge. Last good place to camp IMO before you hit the Animas, and rising early and making the 11am train is definitely do-able, I had no problems. The trail is pretty good (keep an eye out for the columbine carved in the aspen just before the trail intersection which will head steeply downhill to your right). After that, just head down, aim for the river and you'll bisect the Animas trail, and come out very close to the bridge and train tracks.

Overall it's a fantastic loop.

Good luck, have fun, be safe.

-Tom

[blazintoes]

I'm going to throw a monkey-wrench into the thought process here. Think about this; the approach to Ruby is ~4.5 miles and 4000 vert. Chicago is ~6 miles and 3,200 vert. Also Twin Thumbs is slightly steeper and more technical north vs. south.
Boo for heavy packs but ascending under them is relatively easier don't you think? These things always look good on paper but ultimately the knees win.

[Phill the Thrill]

Tom, thanks, that is all good information and very helpful!

I've read a few trip reports (thank you SnowAlien and others) and so I've seen the descent off Twin Thumbs, and your description confirms what I suspected, that the immediate descent from TT is the most difficult part, especially if snow or worse yet, ice, is present. In fact, one person broke an ankle on that section and had a slow, painful walk back to the train. We'll see what info is available on conditions before we leave, but we'll bring our axes just for "insurance" if nothing else.

We'll camp higher in Ruby Basin the night before climbing Pigeon/Turret, so I think we'll move down to the lake's edge as you suggested after climbing those peaks, and that will put us an hour or more closer to the train the next morning.

I've been to Chicago Basin twice, and last time I really wanted to check out Ruby Basin, but the rest of my party wasn't up for that, so I'm looking forward to another opportunity, especially late in the season when I'm expecting a lot fewer people.

[Phill the Thrill]

I'm going to throw a monkey-wrench into the thought process here. Think about this; the approach to Ruby is ~4.5 miles and 4000 vert. Chicago is ~6 miles and 3,200 vert. Also Twin Thumbs is slightly steeper and more technical north vs. south.
Boo for heavy packs but ascending under them is relatively easier don't you think? These things always look good on paper but ultimately the knees win.

I think a case could be made for either direction. Since we'll be dropped off at Needleton around 3:45 pm and the sun sets at 6:50 pm, I'm thinking it's easier to ascend the Needle Creek trail in the late evening and even dark, rather than bushwhacking up to Ruby Lake. Then we're in position to climb the Chicago 14ers early the next morning.

One possibility would be to camp high in the Ruby Basin and climb the 14ers from there - then we would have only our summit packs. Has anyone done that?

[Matt]

Here's another consideration. It comes from my experience going from Ruby to Chicago.
People in your party should be ok doing easy scrambling with a full pack.
The top section (ascending when going Ruby to Chicago), what Tom calls the first 100ft, has a bit--maybe 20-30ft-- of easy class 3.
Not being the fastest guy out there, I had fallen about 15 minutes behind my partners after we stopped for Peak Twelve.
Thanks to the top section, I caught them because one guy wasn't comfortable climbing up with a heavy pack.
I scampered past him and said, "Now who's slow?"
On a related note, do give yourself plenty of time to get back to the train.
Things may have changed since 2012 when I was there, but the Ruby trail's rep for being a pain to find and stay on is justified.
The trail to Chicago Basin is like a super-highway in comparison, easy to find and move quickly on.

[SnowAlien]

My vote is to go CB=> Ruby. I've done Ruby both up and down with the pack and I strongly prefer down. Chicago Basin is superhighway by comparison, and it is more gradual incline and your packs are at the heaviest. Definitely have microspikes and ice ax for the descent off the back side of TT pass, just take it slow. I would also move camp lower to Ruby lake on your 3rd day, as you propose. It took me 3 hr to descent from Ruby lake back to the train, factor in 4-5 hours from upper meadow. Ruby trail is definitely easier to see coming down. Past the Ruby lake, good rule of thumb is to stay to the left of the creek.

[Phill the Thrill]

Thanks, Matt and SnowAlien. I appreciate the advice coming from people who have been there, done that. We will plan on going CB -> NoName -> Ruby, taking it easy with loaded backpacks as we descend the north side of Twin Thumbs Pass. If we find there is too much snow/ice for a safe descent then we'll adjust plans at that time, but I doubt that will be an issue. We'll take ice axe/microspikes in any case.