San Juan Outhouse Issues?

[TallGrass]

Despite the odor when using some, trail head outhouses beat cat-holing or wag-bagging especially in rain or snow, but as mentioned in other threads, some San Juan ones have issues and may be lost.

Uncompahgre: The upper TH has a nice "two story" outhouse. Second story is for business and first is maintenance only access to rake down what is supposed to be a "composting outhouse" given the difficulties of getting a service truck up there to pump it out. It was open when I trail worked there in 2012, but has since been locked. USFS told me it just wasn't composting and breaking down, possibly due to altitude and or temperature, and was just accumulating. In colder weather, the "pile" becomes just one frozen solid mass. The bad news is it's slated for removal. The "good" news is, like service trucks, removal ones can't get up the road either so it's just remained locked. The USFS person also mentioned there are others with the same problem like the "Alpine Tunnel" which get more traffic and thus are higher priority.

Sneffels: The middle TH where many park to do Teakettle has also been under consideration for closure per one USFS worker. It can or has a strong ammonia smell since the #2 doesn't dry out due to ventilation and or cold, and likely because #1 is not diverted via a simple urinal plumbed to route it away from the pile. There was also the issue of no company willing to go and pump it out (it's not a compost one), though I was told they've since found one so it is currently open.

Ideas? Some have said things are getting untidy up at Uncompahgre, maybe not CG "s#!+ and TP everywhere" bad, but not good. If some way could be found to get it to compost, it might be able to be re-opened. USFS noted they don't have a lot of time nor money to throw at it given other priorities. Any biologists, sanitation engineers, successful "managers" of Alaskan outhouses, or others that could lend some traction to keeping these high country seats of ease open, and in some cases, re-opened? Bacteria cultures that break #2 in the cold? Solar-powered fan vents? Diverters to keep #1 from #2? Unimog honeybucket suckers? University grants that could make Uncompahgre a "real time research" out... post? Any solutions could benefit not just these two points, but others along the Alpine Loop, 14ers, and maybe even justify adding some to other THs if the cost and maintenance demands can be kept low enough. No one wants to discover they just re-dug a cat hole.

[larkinrx2]

Solar-powered fan vents?

this seems more of a summer approach but a work through winter approach could be solar powered heating elements in conjunction with these vent fans for optimal temperature "incubator"

[Scott P]

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[JQDivide]

The number of hikers, OHV users, and all-around sight-seers on the Alpine Loop makes wag-bags and personal potties a bad idea.
The USFS services needs to improve the facilities in that area.

[XterraRob]

Need to fabricate an off-road rig that can access those sites to get them pumped out. Or maybe something that can be trailer-ed up that has a pump/tank attached.

Call it "The Rocky Mountain Dump Pump".

[Scott P]

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[TallGrass]

^ How about focusing on solutions to the current situation rather than speculating on less appealing possibilities that are harder to enforce and would be incongruous with all the other Alpine Loop outhouses (and there are a lot of them) and thus unlikely? Effectiveness-wise, pretty sure outhouses have a higher adoption rate than wagbags. Both Uncompahgre and Sneffels see a good percentage of non-hikers such as 4x4s and ATVs.

JQDivide, agreed. Trick is finding something that works. A grad student looking for a project would be great, especially if they want an excuse to visit 14ers year-round. "Sorry, professor. Got to head out to the San Juans to see how my research experiments are going."

XterraRob, had a similar thought. Appears USFS contracts out the pumping. Would a biz be willing to invest in building a one off for a "small" contract? Could the USFS own it and the biz operate it (stored/parked at USFS lot, but emptied serviced along with other biz pumpers)?

Another green passive ventilation tool are Whirly Birds or turbine vents commonly used on roof vents. Uses the wind to help pump old air out and draw new air in.

[XterraRob]

XterraRob, had a similar thought. Appears USFS contracts out the pumping. Would a biz be willing to invest in building a one off for a "small" contract? Could the USFS own it and the biz operate it (stored/parked at USFS lot, but emptied serviced along with other biz pumpers)?

That's probably the best method, USFS owned and contractor operated. If each district had one, maybe we'd see the creation of more outhouses to consolidate the dumps.

[Monte Meals]

The last time I was up in the Canadian Rockies,
all of the national campgrounds (similar to our Forest
Service campgrounds) were serviced by competitive bid
contractors.

Every one of them had a visitor survey form to evaluate
the experience. They were all excellent.

When was the last time that our US Forest Service ASKED
or was even HELD RESPONSIBLE for the poor quality
their GSA personnel?