Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Dogs, dogs and even some cats
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Jeff Valliere
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by Jeff Valliere »

Holliewd wrote:I would not recommend bringing any dog on a 14r.
You are of course free to recommend or not recommend bringing any dog on a 14er, but I respectfully disagree. I have taken my dog Sierra (a 50lb female Australian Shepherd mix) on nearly 100 14er ascents (class 1 to class 3+, Winter peaks, steep snow), countless 13ers/12ers/11ers/10ers, many hundreds of ascents of the peaks in Boulder OSMP, the Aspen 4 Pass loop (26+ miles with 8,000+ feet of gain), all day bushwhacks through LCW, semi technical canyoneering, etc... and have never had a single physical issue with her. Not one bloody paw, not one cut, rip, tear, twisted anything. She has had a few cactus thorns in her paws over the years, has been covered in burrs, has rolled in stinky stuff and has been very tired at the end of a long day(s), but nothing more.

She has a very intuitive sense of route finding and has, on multiple occasions led me through the easiest way on difficult peaks. She also has the sense to not push her limits beyond what she knows she can handle and on multiple occasions we have bailed in favor of an easier route.

I constantly monitor her condition, give her plenty of food and water and never push her beyond what I know she can do (and am constantly re-assessing/adjusting those limits as she ages).

I have also left her home on many occasions as well, where I know the route will be too dangerous, either to her, or others.

There are MANY other dogs out there as well who have done this much and more without incident.

Again (like people), dogs vary widely in their athleticism, agility, fitness, experience, durability, desire and intuition. One thing most dogs have in common though are that they are willing and eager to follow/please/obey their human and thus puts a great deal of responsibility upon the owner to accurately assess their dog and if they are a good fit for any given mountain adventure.

I can say with 100% confidence that Sierra and her closest canine climbing companions over the years (Scooby, Shep, Kiefer) enjoy the mountains every bit as much as we do.

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mtree
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by mtree »

Jeff Valliere wrote:
Holliewd wrote:I would not recommend bringing any dog on a 14r.
I can say with 100% confidence that Sierra and her closest canine climbing companions over the years (Scooby, Shep, Kiefer) enjoy the mountains every bit as much as we do.

Image
Nice pic Jeff! Glad you're one of the responsible dog owners. I wouldn't apply human emotions to a dog. I'd say with 100% confidence your dog enjoys hiking ANYWHERE as long as its with you. Couldn't care less or know the difference between a mountain, a canyon, or rolling hillside. Just wants to hang with you. All owners should recognize this and be wary in forcing a dog into terrain beyond its comfort level or ability. Many dogs just want to please the master and will do everything it can to accomplish this, regardless of its own safety and well-being.
- I didn't say it was your fault. I said I was blaming you.
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by Jeff Valliere »

People have a tendency to anthropomorphize when it comes to their pets, especially their dogs and there have been many debates on the topic, but I do truly believe that Sierra and canine friends in the photo (Scooby passed away in 2008 and Shep no longer climbs) had a higher level of enjoyment on the peaks than they do anywhere else. They seemed very driven to get to a summit, had a special spring in their step, a pronounced smile and level of enthusiastic energy that I do not see elsewhere. Yes, they love being with us, but they love most being with us AND in the mountains.
Last edited by Jeff Valliere on Wed Jul 30, 2014 10:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by simargl »

Mike Shepherd wrote:I have a coworker who has taken his dog on Capitol. I've personally seen it go up Torreys via the dead dog couloir. It's doable if the pooch is at home on the mountains. He short ropes it for some parts.
Mike is mentioning my pup. My pup, Melvin, has a different aptitude then my family other dogs to allow him to climb more technical routes. For the hard stuff I designed a full strength harness for him. As of now he has summited 51 of the 53 (or 56 of th 58) 14ers.

My recommendation is to start on easier Class 3 or where the Class 3 section is short to see how the pup handles it. A harness is great in case you need to help them up a rock section or something. Boots are good for easy approaches but actually decrease traction in the technical areas. I use them to save his pads on the rocks during the approach and exit but take them off for the technical sections. I only started this two years ago since he is getting older and having a few more issues with wearing his pads down. Also for cut or other injuries on the pads I use gauze, then coban wrap so it doesn't stick to their fur and then a few layers of athletic tape. It works well to get them out safely. Attached is a picture of me practicing repelling with my pup, I will find the one on Capital's Knife Edge.
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mtree
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by mtree »

That's just whacked! I don't get it and never will. To each his/her own. Enjoy. Just don't drop that dog on my head!
- I didn't say it was your fault. I said I was blaming you.
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by BillMiddlebrook »

No offense, but that seems retarded :P. I suppose it's good practice for rescuing animals in precarious places.

I did get a good laugh from the look on the dog's face, though.
"When I go out, I become more alive. I just love skiing. The gravitational pull. When you ski steep terrain... you can almost get a feeling of flying." -Doug Coombs
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by 12ersRule »

mtree wrote:That's just whacked! I don't get it and never will. To each his/her own. Enjoy. Just don't drop that dog on my head!
The dog seems to be enjoying it. Just look at the big sh!t eating grin on his face!
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by mkrier »

If I tried doing that with my dog, she would find a way to kill us both.
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Mel McKinney
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by Mel McKinney »

The photo of Melvin made me think of a recent National Geographic article on "Hero Dogs." These are seriously patient dogs. I don't know any dogs with that trait! :lol:

03-dog-practices-rappelling-from-roof-670.jpg
03-dog-practices-rappelling-from-roof-670.jpg (100.87 KiB) Viewed 3980 times
Photo caption:
Trainers at K2 Solutions, a private contractor in North Carolina, train Bassie to work with military and law enforcement units. She practices rappelling from a roof and leaping through a window to confront an enemy, reducing the risk to the men who follow.
Mountains cast spells on me - Why, because of the way Earth-heaps lie, should I be Chocked by joy mysteriously; stilled or drunken-gay? Why should a brown hill trail Tug at my feet to go? Why should a boggy swale Tune my heart to a nameless tale Mountain marshes know?
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by mtgirl »

Mel McKinney wrote:The photo of Melvin made me think of a recent National Geographic article on "Hero Dogs." These are seriously patient dogs. I don't know any dogs with that trait! :lol:

03-dog-practices-rappelling-from-roof-670.jpg
Photo caption:
Trainers at K2 Solutions, a private contractor in North Carolina, train Bassie to work with military and law enforcement units. She practices rappelling from a roof and leaping through a window to confront an enemy, reducing the risk to the men who follow.

That soldier has a nice butt. Oh wait, now I see the dog in the photo. #-o
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Mel McKinney
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by Mel McKinney »

mtgirl wrote: That soldier has a nice butt. Oh wait, now I see the dog in the photo. #-o
Oh you, Vicki! [-X :-D

The excitement of getting your photo printed in Nat Geo, but it's wrong end. Or maybe it was the right end.
Mountains cast spells on me - Why, because of the way Earth-heaps lie, should I be Chocked by joy mysteriously; stilled or drunken-gay? Why should a brown hill trail Tug at my feet to go? Why should a boggy swale Tune my heart to a nameless tale Mountain marshes know?
--- Belle Turnbull ("Mountain-Mad")
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Re: Dog on Class 3s or Difficult Class 2s??

Post by juj333 »

Jeff Valliere wrote:People have a tendency to anthropomorphize when it comes to their pets, especially their dogs and there have been many debates on the topic, but I do truly believe that Sierra and canine friends in the photo (Scooby passed away in 2008 and Shep no longer climbs) had a higher level of enjoyment on the peaks than they do anywhere else. They seemed very driven to get to a summit, had a special spring in their step, a pronounced smile and level of enthusiastic energy that I do not see elsewhere. Yes, they love being with us, but they love most being with us AND in the mountains.
I completely agree with you Jeff. My dog (Tebow) loves getting to a summit. He sits up on top and takes in the view just like the rest of us. Everything you've said about how you climb with Sierra is the same I do for Tebow. If I lead him up a route he doesn't care for he always finds an easier one. Most of the time he's in front of me, so if a rock is kicked out from under him I'm the recipient. I wish I knew how to add pics so I could show everyone how happy Tebow is to be on a summit.

And Holliewd--I'll never have the trouble of bloody paws, because Tebow always wears his booties. He's more skilled at hiking than several people I've seen. He's also well equipped. I carry food not only for me but for him also. I monitor him and his abilities constantly. He's very obedient and like a human child actually responds on the count of 3. Thus, when it comes to Marmots and pikas, if I count, he's back at my heels in no time. I bring him along because he's happy to be with me and because I'm happy to be with him. He's my companion and hiking partner--and a damn good one at that. I care about his safety very much--that is way I took the precaution of making this forum to ask other's with experience their take on bringing dogs on higher class 14ers. If I didn't care I wouldn't have even bothered. Nor would I be willing to buy $60+ boots for him every several peaks we do.
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