The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

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Alpinefroggy
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by Alpinefroggy »

daway8 wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 1:00 pm
Alpinefroggy wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 12:53 pm
daway8 wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 12:44 pm I recommend bringing along an old pair of microspikes for the gullies - gives you much greater confidence in your footing especially on those loose dirt sections (I wrote up an extensive review of using them in my "One Bell at a Time" report).

There's a lot of little loose stuff around but just go real slow and you'll be fine. At a couple points I remember briefly walking in exaggerated slow motion so as not to send anything down on the people below me (it worked).
This seems wildly dubious to me. But idk seems like you wouldn't get much more purchase at all.
Oh I was skeptical too when someone on this site first mentioned it but I was shocked at how much difference it made. Now I never do a hike anywhere at any time of year without microspikes in my pack (it does wear the points dull though).

If you want more details and analysis the trip report is here: https://www.14ers.com/php14ers/triprepo ... m=tripmine there's a bolded section halfway down called "Microspikes on dirt/small loose rocks" that gives detailed analysis, plus various other comments sprinkled through the report.
I just read that. Still dubious but I have an old pair and will try on some scree crap here on some grassy ledges in Boulder. Seems like all the gullies in terms of steepness are overrated but the rockfall due to the elk choss is incredibly serious.

Just read the whole report, bookmarked.That provides excellant beta. Have you done scott gomer gully? That has definitely been the loosest and crapiest gully I've been in and it was steep, loose and took me close to an hour of slow sidestep sliding and scree glissading.
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by dwoodward13 »

I think just based on the fact that you are doing the traverse the descent down NM is going to be far more tedious and potentially dangerous. If you are ready for the traverse, the actually climbing itself on either peak shouldn't be hard. However, its very easy to get off track descending something you didn't come up, especially late in the day after you have had to be mentally "on" for so long. Our experienced group of 4 handled the up M and the traverse with relative ease, but then were led astray by some wayward cairns upon the descent on NM. Turned into a spicy few moments. Have all the route pictures downloaded, and take care to assess if the cairns you are following actually make sense. Even if you don't think you need to, check your pictures/route description every so often. IMO gps is not very useful here as a signal error of 100 feet (very common) could have you on the opposite side of the mountains so don't expect that to get you out of a jamb.
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by Alpinefroggy »

dwoodward13 wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 1:23 pm I think just based on the fact that you are doing the traverse the descent down NM is going to be far more tedious and potentially dangerous. If you are ready for the traverse, the actually climbing itself on either peak shouldn't be hard. However, its very easy to get off track descending something you didn't come up, especially late in the day after you have had to be mentally "on" for so long. Our experienced group of 4 handled the up M and the traverse with relative ease, but then were led astray by some wayward cairns upon the descent on NM. Turned into a spicy few moments. Have all the route pictures downloaded, and take care to assess if the cairns you are following actually make sense. Even if you don't think you need to, check your pictures/route description every so often. IMO gps is not very useful here as a signal error of 100 feet (very common) could have you on the opposite side of the mountains so don't expect that to get you out of a jamb.
I am leaving no elk choss unturned here. Meaning that in every spot from the beginning of M's ridge all the way until I set foot out of the rock glacier is going to be carefully analyzed to see where people go wrong. I know some of the tricky parts of descending NM are the crossover between the gullies (Neddle deja vu) and then the ridge ride.
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by daway8 »

Alpinefroggy wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 1:10 pm I just read that. Still dubious but I have an old pair and will try on some scree crap here on some grassy ledges in Boulder. Seems like all the gullies in terms of steepness are overrated but the rockfall due to the elk choss is incredibly serious.

Just read the whole report, bookmarked.That provides excellant beta. Have you done scott gomer gully? That has definitely been the loosest and crapiest gully I've been in and it was steep, loose and took me close to an hour of slow sidestep sliding and scree glissading.
As best as I recall I seem to remember Scott Gomer being more of a loose dirt kind of descent with scree mixed in - the Bells I recall having a lot more (and somewhat larger) loose rock in the mix in some of those gullies. Don't recall what my times were for that one.

The pictures always make these gullies look epic in terms of steepness. While an uncontrolled fall would be bad they're generally less imposing in person, except for someone who has problems with heights/exposure. Route finding is the bigger concern on these peaks.
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by nyker »

Agree with the aforementioned comments on route finding on both peaks will make or break a trip.

The one thing I can say is North Maroon is one of the few peaks where I was legitimately scared while coming down (after having climbed up watching some rocks fall and narrowly miss us and others).

The steep grassy slopes lull you into complacency thinking that it would be easy, and the climbing/hiking up is not real difficult. However with the steep slopes there, microwave sized rocks would come off and they'd be silent as they flew past, you would not hear them at all and that was the scariest part. At least in the gullies you heard them above you and you could react, to make it marginally "feel" safer.

You need to watch out for people both above and below you on these two, and be mindful of goats above inadvertently knocking rocks loose. Recent rains/winds or snowmelt could also trigger rocks.
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by Alpinefroggy »

daway8 wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 2:59 pm
Alpinefroggy wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 1:10 pm I just read that. Still dubious but I have an old pair and will try on some scree crap here on some grassy ledges in Boulder. Seems like all the gullies in terms of steepness are overrated but the rockfall due to the elk choss is incredibly serious.

Just read the whole report, bookmarked.That provides excellant beta. Have you done scott gomer gully? That has definitely been the loosest and crapiest gully I've been in and it was steep, loose and took me close to an hour of slow sidestep sliding and scree glissading.
As best as I recall I seem to remember Scott Gomer being more of a loose dirt kind of descent with scree mixed in - the Bells I recall having a lot more (and somewhat larger) loose rock in the mix in some of those gullies. Don't recall what my times were for that one.

The pictures always make these gullies look epic in terms of steepness. While an uncontrolled fall would be bad they're generally less imposing in person, except for someone who has problems with heights/exposure. Route finding is the bigger concern on these peaks.
Thank you for that last sentance. I can get caught up on nonsensical and ultimately unreasonable crap. I have so much more to worry about on these routes then the gullies from the loose rock to the rockfall to route finding that as long as the gullies are easier than they look and I have poles and maybe even spikes, I'll be fine on them and I should worry about everything else.
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by Will_E »

CaptainSuburbia wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 11:36 am The Maroon gullies are not that bad. Just stay on route and it's a fun climb. Taking screenshots from the route page helps. There is a direct ridge route if you really want to avoid the gullies. It has more rock climbing which you might like better.
The Captain meant to say “S Maroon is the most fantastic peak ever. It is without flaw.”
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by ClimbingFool »

All of these posts are increasing my anxiety level for a planned bells traverse at the end of June. Does anyone have good pictures and a route description to get off Norrh Maroon? Usually I take pictures on the way up to mark the exit points for the return but with the traverse that won't work.
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by BillMiddlebrook »

ClimbingFool wrote: Thu May 06, 2021 8:51 am All of these posts are increasing my anxiety level for a planned bells traverse at the end of June. Does anyone have good pictures and a route description to get off Norrh Maroon? Usually I take pictures on the way up to mark the exit points for the return but with the traverse that won't work.
Use the route description here on the site. It includes plenty of photos looking down the route
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by CaptainSuburbia »

Will_E wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 6:48 pm
CaptainSuburbia wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 11:36 am The Maroon gullies are not that bad. Just stay on route and it's a fun climb. Taking screenshots from the route page helps. There is a direct ridge route if you really want to avoid the gullies. It has more rock climbing which you might like better.
The Captain meant to say “S Maroon is the most fantastic peak ever. It is without flaw.”
That's exactly what I meant. It's second only to Little Bear :-D
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by supranihilest »

CaptainSuburbia wrote: Thu May 06, 2021 9:18 am
Will_E wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 6:48 pm
CaptainSuburbia wrote: Wed May 05, 2021 11:36 am The Maroon gullies are not that bad. Just stay on route and it's a fun climb. Taking screenshots from the route page helps. There is a direct ridge route if you really want to avoid the gullies. It has more rock climbing which you might like better.
The Captain meant to say “S Maroon is the most fantastic peak ever. It is without flaw.”
That's exactly what I meant. It's second only to Little Bear :-D
Both of you have rocks for brains. :mrgreen:
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Re: The loose gullies on North Maroon and Maroon Peak

Post by Count40 »

AlpineFroggy, Climbing Fool, consider this.

Before the traverse trip, how about doing just the North Maroon on its' own first?
That will eliminate doubts, and also get you acquainted with Elks rock and "ledges-thinking".
And, while at it, add Pyramid on such a weekend. A shorter walk than NM.
Maroons traverse is a bit of a big bite.
See private message for the rest.

Also, Climbing Fool, depending on how May and early June develop weather-wise, consider some time later in the year.
Even without patchy snow, (Morning and shade) verglas is just not fun at all. It is hard enough and gambling enough as it is.
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