Crestone Needle dihedral

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Burazin19
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by Burazin19 »

I completed the traverse from Peak to Needle twice in the month of August and descended both the class 4 east gully and the class 3 west gully with the cross over on the separate occasions. I honestly felt the class 4 gully was easier. It's a straight shot up or down on mostly solid rock, no stress of missing the crossover. It's steep, but not really any different that the steepest sections of the west gully. After doing both in such a narrow time span I would never recommend messing around with the west (class 3) gully to anyone seeking advice on either the ascent or descent of Needle.
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bdloftin77
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by bdloftin77 »

TomPierce wrote: Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:36 am
Reg0928 wrote: Tue Sep 21, 2021 6:17 am I would give my vote for making the east gully the standard as well. I've been up The Needle 3 times now, and every time I've gone up the east and down the standard. Even if you take route finding out of the equation, I found the crossover move to be trickier than any move in the east gully. When you add in the constant route finding issues, taking the east gully is a no brainer
It's obviously Bill's call to make, but elevating the Easy Gully to the standard route on this site makes sense to me. Personally I never found anything on the Needle all that difficult, but every year there seem to be multiple "events" on the Needle (disoriented climbers, accidents, etc.) and extended discussions about painting arrows, placing signs to identify the correct route. If those events can be avoided it sure makes sense to me, a good proactive step. Just my opinion.

-Tom
+1
Gritz3000
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by Gritz3000 »

I did the west gully route in August. We crossed the dihedral lower than the pictures on 14ers.com. I just climbed down to the bottom of the gap, then back up the other side. The couple moves after were a bit exposed, but pretty straight forward.
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nmjameswilson
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by nmjameswilson »

This was a bit more involved than pretty much any other portion of the route but still class 3 IMO. I spent a minute deciding on how to proceed but it wasn't that hard and if you slip it is only maybe 4 feet down. With that said I am 5'-11" and my climbing partner had issues in this area since he is around 5'-8". I do not think erosion will further impact that exact area too much more now as it is solid rock where you climb up now.

Question: Are the pink ribbons at cairns and the spike at the crossover still on the route? I found route finding not that hard but they did have the ribbons when I climbed in August. I wonder who placed them and if the service or others will mark the trail like Longs due to all the SAR incidents.
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vandy
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by vandy »

I also think the east gully direct is the logical route. Less tricky to get into at the top than the west gully, and personally I found the crossover to be the most difficult of any moves we did that day (east gully direct up and traditional route on the way down). Maybe there was just something about it that didn't agree with me, but I found one move on the crossover to be trickier than any move on Kit Carson's North Ridge. I don't think the crossover is that difficult to find if one does research and pays attention, but clearly it stumps some folks, so that's another plus in favor of the east gully.
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scvaughn
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by scvaughn »

First, thank you all for providing opinions about the best way to go. I'm planning a climb, and have been wavering about the route to take at this critical juncture. For what it's worth, I have thoroughly enjoyed Kit Carson, the Class 3 Blanca-Ellingwood traverse, Wetterhorn, and Crestone Peak. My desire to "keep it Class 3" may be misguided, and the East Gully seems like the better option.
Last edited by scvaughn on Tue Aug 09, 2022 6:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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andrewhamilton
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by andrewhamilton »

I descended the west gully after completing the traverse a couple of days ago and was surprised that there was only one cairn marking the exit from the west to east gully. It really didn’t seem obvious at all, except at how steep the west gully gets after that point. It seems like that spot was much more conspicuously marked at times in the past.
And like others i found those moves in the crossover to be the crux of the descent for us.

I’ve only taken the east gully all the way up once 10 years ago but i did do that with a 5 year old and i remember it being pretty steep, but pretty nice class 3.

So i think I’m agreeing with those that suggest just sticking with the east gully and avoiding those slightly awkward moves in the crossover. Seems like a pretty good route with less chance of making a catastrophic mistake on the descent.
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by JaredJohnson »

Adding to the chorus in favor of the east gully direct.

On my very first summit of the needle, the group I tagged along with on the west gully route left a colorful bandana tied to the cairn at the crossover when they went up, and I still personally didn't see it on the way down and was surprised when the group found it.

When my partner and I did the traverse, we had both gone up and down the "crossover route" on previous climbs; he had done it solo so he had definitely found the gully and crossover on his own, just one year earlier. We still descended the wrong gully.. I don't even think we made it into the west gully, I think we did a west-er-er gully and had a difficult self rescue or at least borderline self rescue kinda day.

Since then I've done the traverse 3 more times, descending the East Gully route each time, and it's very straightforward finding the entrance to the east gully. Easy to explain to others who have never set foot on the summit as well, using the photo of the east and west gully entrances from the south face route description and the "shark fin" formation from that photo as a reference. And of course after finding it one doesn't need to agonize about whether they're still in the right gully or have missed the exit.

The class is indeed a little harder above the crossover, but it's doable. I descended once in pouring rain and boots that it turned out had garbage traction. It was hell but I was still more than glad I was doing something where I knew I could stay on-route.

If you're going up and down the Needle, isn't it better to try going up class 4 and get turned around if you aren't up to the grade, rather than attempt a route that takes significantly more effort to stay alive on, even for experienced mountaineers?

If you're doing the traverse and nervous about class 4 then you shouldn't do the traverse. And descending the west gully after the traverse without the ascent fresh in your mind makes it that much more work to stay alive.

A vote for the east gully is a vote for staying alive! (:
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defygravity
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by defygravity »

In 2013 I did all five up there and ended up finishing the traverse in the dark. Unfortunately, I forgot my route sheet for how to descend the Needle, had not really read about it in advance, and went down straight off the peak and way too far to the west.

Long story short, I spent 3 hours wandering around the cliffed-out gullies 500-1000 ft. below the summit and in the dark. It was terrifying but I kept my cool and always kept awareness of how to back track.

I worked my way back to the summit at 1AM, and successfuly went to the east, getting back down around 3am. It was really windy and very cold, which made the whole thing scarier. I learned many things from the experience. Most of all, do your research!

Anyways, ever since then I've stuck with the East gully because it prevents any confusion and feel that is definitely worth any extra difficulty!
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bdloftin77
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by bdloftin77 »

JaredJohnson wrote: Mon Aug 08, 2022 3:32 am Adding to the chorus in favor of the east gully direct.

If you're going up and down the Needle, isn't it better to try going up class 4 and get turned around if you aren't up to the grade, rather than attempt a route that takes significantly more effort to stay alive on, even for experienced mountaineers?

If you're doing the traverse and nervous about class 4 then you shouldn't do the traverse. And descending the west gully after the traverse without the ascent fresh in your mind makes it that much more work to stay alive.

A vote for the east gully is a vote for staying alive! (:
+1

I’d vote for the east gully to be the standard route as well.
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by scvaughn »

I climbed Crestone Needle today via the East Gully. It's FUN, logical, and the rock is of excellent quality. Thank you to everyone who encouraged me not to bother with the crossover.
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strayster2
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Re: Crestone Needle dihedral

Post by strayster2 »

I've never understood the hate for the crossover, and I've done it both ways.

Though more direct, the exposure and route-finding in the East gully felt at least twice as difficult and scary as the moves to get across the dihedral (and to find it on the way back down).

The West gully was some of the most fun and intuitive scrambling I encountered on all the 14ers.

If you pay attention and study the route (which you should be doing anyway, right?), I don't think it's a problem.

But do whatever makes you the most comfortable.
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