Settle a Debate between My Friend and I

[mtree]

"Summiting" only refers to reaching the summit. How you got there is a different question.

[Skimo95]

E-Bikes are a nuisance in Aspen, I hope people don’t start riding them on trail. Can’t seem to find my inner Lance Armstrong

[cedica]

Can’t seem to find my inner Lance Armstrong

I do it every day, just like da man:

sofa.jpg (15.65 KiB) Viewed 560 times

[greenonion]

Mechanical advantage doesn't produce the energy for you, it doesn't artificially increase your power, it just helps you spend more energy in the shorter amount of time. So in my book all bikes except electric and motor bikes are acceptable, also skis, rollers and skateboards.

Imho, using handcar or draisine or even rowboat on Mount Evans Road would be ok. but using a sailboat to summit a 14er would constitute cheating.

+1 For me, it should require physical effort vs fueled motorization.

But if the vortex powering the sailboat sucked the sailor out and deposited him/her on a summit, then it’s time to celebrate with mojitos.

[dpage]

" I claim that you must complete a mountaineering route (regardless of if it's on a bike or hiking)"

If the above is what the OP believes, nothing on the survey counts as hiking, walking, and cycling by whatever route is not mountaineering.

[Wentzl]

Words matter. Here is the OP question:

What qualifies as summiting a 14er

"Qualifies" and "Summiting" are two interesting choices.

What if the question were;

"What counts as climbing to the summit",

would the response be any different? I suggest, yes.

And what was the intent of OP? What if I parasail from the valley floor, at least 3000' below the summit for you purists, and land on the summit? Would that "qualify as a summit?" Hard to argue no. Can I claim that I climbed the mountain? Of course not.

So, OP, what are you asking?

[d_baker]

E-Bikes are a nuisance in Aspen, I hope people don’t start riding them on trail.

is there merit in a complaint from a recent transplant to the RFC, as well as a not-so-distant Floridian transplant?

Now if all those tourists that are renting e-bikes just drove around town instead...would be so much better?
Or is it the real locals that have gotten tired of the tourists and new-to-town folks that drive all over and clog up streets, have just decided getting around on a bike (e or self-powered) is a better form of getting from Pt A to Pt B to be a better solution?
Another debate to settle...hahaha

[ekalina]

In a nutshell, yes, it counts if you think it should. But for me, the LoJ definition of ascending a peak makes a lot of sense:

"Arriving at the highest natural ground is required to claim an ascent of a peak. This means if a 10ft pillar of stone sits atop an otherwise flat and expansive summit, one must get atop this stone. Some feel it is sufficient to "touch the top" with a hand, while others require standing or sitting on the highest rock. Use your own judgment, but at a minimum your body should touch the highest natural surface."

https://www.listsofjohn.com/glossary#Ascent

According to this perspective, you don't need to walk X feet to say you summited a certain peak. If conditions allowed, you could drive to the summit, stick your foot out of the car, touch the top, and it would count. What are the benefits of this perspective (besides rewarding laziness)? Well, many/most peaks (most commonly the ones below 13K) don't have an established trailhead or starting point. You might choose to start at a random pull off on the side of a county road somewhere. That pull off could be many miles from the summit, a half mile from it, or the pull off might be the summit (or anything in between).

Saying that walking over to the Mt. Evans summit from your car doesn't count implies that there is some minimum distance X that you must travel before you can say you summited. But how would you select that threshold? Is 1000 ft enough? 0.5 miles? 1 mile? Equivalent to the peak's isolation from other peaks? (Get ready to walk 4600 miles for Denali.) At the end of the day, it would get pretty arbitrary. That's why I like the definition above. If you can walk to the top of that 14er in 5 minutes from your car, go for it. They won't all be that easy. Tomorrow you might find yourself walking 15 miles for an 8er. Or maybe that's just me.

[Skimo95]

E-Bikes are a nuisance in Aspen, I hope people don’t start riding them on trail.

is there merit in a complaint from a recent transplant to the RFC, as well as a not-so-distant Floridian transplant?

Now if all those tourists that are renting e-bikes just drove around town instead...would be so much better?
Or is it the real locals that have gotten tired of the tourists and new-to-town folks that drive all over and clog up streets, have just decided getting around on a bike (e or self-powered) is a better form of getting from Pt A to Pt B to be a better solution?
Another debate to settle...hahaha

Hey Darin, hope you’re well.

Aspen is actually planning on opening a bike only lane for a few streets. No complaints here, life is great. I just wish there was a speed governor on a few of them I also think it’s great people are getting outdoors more. After all we are one of the most obese countries in the world! Take care

[nyker]

It's your list. Count them how you want.

+1

With that said, in the context of mountaineering, I'd think "summiting" usually means walking/climbing under your own power on terra firma from a somewhat arbitrary but collectively accepted starting point to the highest point on the summit ridge/plateau. I suppose you can create your own list of summits however you want to define them but in a conversation with other mountaineers, summiting via bicycle vs walking probably won't be considered apples and apples; i.e. how did you get up that chimney?, class 4 move, etc.

You can say you summited on a mountain bike, road bike, unicycle, skateboard, hovercraft, UFO or whatever (and in fact you did summit and can claim that), but in the traditional mountaineering sense, on a mountaineering community while impressive to do on a bike for sure, I wouldn't say that's the same as hiking up with only your feet sans mechanical advantage that wheels afford. However if you are in a cycling community, then the definition of summiting is likely different and it would qualify, getting to the top via paved road or off road trail.

[angry]

Probably the only time "the how" counts is if one is claiming a "first."
If you're claiming something, be sure to leave business cards and or fliers in/with summit registers for self-promotion.

OMG please don't do that and leave your book flyers at home!

[d_baker]

Probably the only time "the how" counts is if one is claiming a "first."
If you're claiming something, be sure to leave business cards and or fliers in/with summit registers for self-promotion.

OMG please don't do that and leave your book flyers at home!

Why not?
It "worked" for Dr Jon, and now he's (in)famous.