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You know, after looking at the pictures, the excuse that this might have been a "road" on a topo mapo does not hold up. Just look at the "road".. it's a trail at best, no matter what the map says.

mountaingoat-G wrote:You know, after looking at the pictures, the excuse that this might have been a "road" on a topo mapo does not hold up. Just look at the "road".. it's a trail at best, no matter what the map says.

The entire Rubicon Trail (including the Little Sluice, which isn't even a trail at best) in CA is a "road" on google maps. Anyone that has driven through the L.S. can tell you its a pile of very large boulders, but its still designated a road, a 4x4 trail.

What one perceives to be extreme may be tame in the eyes of someone else.

In response to making fun of the guy's poor decision making; at any point in his journey he could have put it in reverse and backed up to a place that he could turn around. Yes we all make poor choices and learn from them, but this guy was like 45-50 and it probably wasn't his first time off roading. What makes it even worse was that he (and me and my friend) sat there and watched the dirt biker ahead of him get stuck because of all the loose rock and dirt. Any man that didn't need to hold on to his pride so much would have made the decision to abort mission at that point. Basically I compare it to he refused to stop and ask directions and now he's lost.

getwrenchy wrote: Yes we all make poor choices and learn from them,

I'll bet he learns something from this one.

getwrenchy wrote: but this guy was like 45-50 and it probably wasn't his first time off roading.

I don't know him - so I couldn't say one way or the other.
What I can say is that he got stuck - the same thing that happens on 4wd roads all over the state all the time. (yes - I know it is more of a trail than a road, but it is designated as a 4wd road) For whatever reason, this one has people armed with tar and feathers.

upndown wrote:(I know it is more of a trail than a road, but it is designated as a 4wd road) For whatever reason, this one has people armed with tar and feathers.

There's an exclusivity that permeates with many people on this website that the summit experience is for hikers alone, not those in cars. They forgive people who claim to have "summited" Pikes Peak and Mt. Evans by vehicle, but wish to relegate 4WD recreation to places they aren't at and won't be at. When a vehicle enters the realm they feel is sacred to their enjoyment - especially when it sticks out in such an obvious manner as this does - it's an easy target for them to ridicule.

I think the biggest problem with this incident, and ones like it in the past, is that he went BEYOND the road and tried driving up a trail. Many hikers probably wouldn't have given it much thought if the vehicle was seen on the road.

It would be kinda like someone driving their motorcycle up the Mt. Evans road and then saying "Hey, I'll just ride up this trail to get to the top!" The more that I think about it, it may have already been done.

Agreed; some of the older quad maps don't show where the "Jeep Trail" becomes a "Pack Trail" until it may be too late. Argentine Pass - Jeep Trail up to the summit from Guanella, definitely not a jeep trail to the south (and, no, it doesn't stop the idiots.) I wasn't sure if this was the case or not as I've seen plenty of vehicles on the saddle between Bross and Lincoln for CFI work and the like.

Rule of thumb: If the tire tracks disappear - go back, there's a reason.

BillMiddlebrook wrote: I think the biggest problem with this incident, and ones like it in the past, is that he went BEYOND the road and tried driving up a trail. Many hikers probably wouldn't have given it much thought if the vehicle was seen on the road.

Agree, I have seen vehicles all the way up the road on Bross.

wildlobo71 wrote:Agreed; some of the older quad maps don't show where the "Jeep Trail" becomes a "Pack Trail" until it may be too late. Argentine Pass - Jeep Trail up to the summit from Guanella, definitely not a jeep trail to the south (and, no, it doesn't stop the idiots.) I wasn't sure if this was the case or not as I've seen plenty of vehicles on the saddle between Bross and Lincoln for CFI work and the like.

Yes - You can’t depend on the line on a map to indicate when a maintained dirt road will become a 4WD road and then a hiking trail. Many of our hiking trails are former vehicle roads from historic activities. In addition to leave no trace ethics, a person has to make a judgment call when it makes sense to continue. This is not the first large stock pickup I have seen stuck where good judgment would have said to stop. Hopefully he can get it out of there before winter claims it. This could be an expensive mistake.

will they make him winterize it?
take out battery, drain antifreeze that obviously wont make it up there at those temps/winds?
i wonder if any marmots got the brake lines yet?

All I know is, I'm hiking the Decalibron fast before they close it again.

BillMiddlebrook wrote:I think the biggest problem with this incident, and ones like it in the past, is that he went BEYOND the road and tried driving up a trail. Many hikers probably wouldn't have given it much thought if the vehicle was seen on the road.

Right - and I get that. He deserves what he gets. There's no cheap, easy way to get that thing out of there so one way or another, he'll pay.

BillMiddlebrook wrote: It would be kinda like someone driving their motorcycle up the Mt. Evans road and then saying "Hey, I'll just ride up this trail to get to the top!" The more that I think about it, it may have already been done.

Would that be legal?

This guy was well beyond the end of the road, which ends at the Mt. Bross-Mt. Cameron saddle. The trail from that point to the northeast (below Mt. Cameron) starts out as a sort-of two-track trail, but then it goes down to a single track path. The truck was a few tens of yards past where the two track path ends. Not sure what the driver was thinking - maybe 'there'll be a place to turn around just a bit farther ahead.'

Nick