6 caught in avy on Torreys (6/6)

[SnowAlien]

...a pattern of warm days and clear nights (not necessarily cold) is required to set up snow conditions that are safe (and enjoyable) to climb when it's this warm. It seems counterintuitive, but this is why in Colorado snow climbs usually aren't great until at least mid June.

Would you describe great snow climbs as having sun-cupped snow? Because mid-June seems to be kinda late for good skiing (i.e. smooth snow, lack of avy debris, rock fall or suncups).

[Boggy B]

Would you describe great snow climbs as having sun-cupped snow? Because mid-June seems to be kinda late for good skiing (i.e. smooth snow, lack of avy debris, rock fall or suncups).

The springtime discussions on this site get confusing, but these folks were snow climbing. Springtime riders have the unenviable task of balancing good climbing conditions and good riding conditions, but when your kind start complaining about suncups and runnels is when I know climbing conditions are good. Suncups aren't ideal for climbing until you need to rest your burning calves, but they're also not always present. Avalanches aren't a huge concern once the snow goes isothermic, and I don't encounter much avy debris by late June. Cornices will usually have collapsed by this point, but some will remain and may or may not be safe to climb on or under. Among many contributing factors, rockfall should be expected whenever snow is rapidly melting and receding from the underlying terrain. That happens pretty aggressively during the spring skimo season, but it's also the primary reason to start early on snow climbs and bail if you can't manage your exposure to overhead hazards.

[lordhelmut]

Would you describe great snow climbs as having sun-cupped snow? Because mid-June seems to be kinda late for good skiing (i.e. smooth snow, lack of avy debris, rock fall or suncups).

The springtime discussions on this site get confusing, but these folks were snow climbing. Springtime riders have the unenviable task of balancing good climbing conditions and good riding conditions, but when your kind start complaining about suncups and runnels is when I know climbing conditions are good. Suncups aren't ideal for climbing until you need to rest your burning calves, but they're also not always present. Avalanches aren't a huge concern once the snow goes isothermic, and I don't encounter much avy debris by late June. Cornices will usually have collapsed by this point, but some will remain and may or may not be safe to climb on or under. Among many contributing factors, rockfall should be expected whenever snow is rapidly melting and receding from the underlying terrain. That happens pretty aggressively during the spring skimo season, but it's also the primary reason to start early on snow climbs and bail if you can't manage your exposure to overhead hazards.

I agree waiting till late May/June mitigates a lot of this crap. If we consistently had a good snow year, or skiers had more patience or we had these refreshes late in Spring, that might be a reality. The more years I'm alive, the less I want to ski in anything that resembles avy terrain until later and later in the season. This winter was a perfect storm of a res sytem at the resorts, which drove more to the backcountry in a historically bad snowpack, resulting in an abnormal # of deaths. With that being said, whatever the hell those climbers were doing on a direct East facing aspect at that time after those overnight temps and clouds and temps above 12k - as mentioned previously, not sure what else to expect here. Like Bean mentioned, 4 hours to barely the middle of Dead Dog, it's obvious there was 0 sense of urgency. The only thing that surprises me is this doesn't happen every day in this state at this point. Not saying I'm an expert, but there seems to be a lot of basic fundamentals being ignored in this state in all seasons.

[Monster5]

^Fully agreed with the last part. This incident is not "wrong time, wrong place." This was a failure in route planning.

[Trotter]

We went up dead dog today. There was some very weird markings in the snow about halfway up that had us confused, guess this situation explains it. Nice clear skies made it a good freeze. But, about an hour after sunrise several small rocks came down on their own in the center of the couloir. We stuck to the side after that, with no problems. Even in Bills route description it mentions the rockfall, and the early sun hit. Start nice and early on this route.

[Trotter]

PS I'd be more interested to find out how the person who apparently cut their butt open pretty good glissading was doing

[mtn_nut]

It seems like Brit Jones, globreal, was one of the people involved in this accident. Some more info was posted on this GoFundMe.

https://www.gofundme.com/f/britt-jones-medical-expenses

[Carl_Healy]

It seems like Brit Jones, globreal, was one of the people involved in this accident. Some more info was posted on this GoFundMe.

https://www.gofundme.com/f/britt-jones-medical-expenses

Yikes!

I'm relatively new here but know Britt is a legend, and certainly regret not being able to join him on Quandary's West Ridge last Winter Welcomer as I had initially planned.

I certainly hope we're all able to help him out here and that he's able to have a speedy recovery.

[Dave B]

Wait, this was a CMC led climb? Choosing to practice running belays at 9a around 13k on an east facing cooler after a weak freeze?

It's unfortunate that folks were injured, especially Brit, but forest for the trees, guys, c'mon.

[climbingcue]

When I first say this post I was wondering if it was any of our forum members. Get well soon Britt...

[Bean]

CMC

Well that explains the unreasonably slow pace and complete failure in planning regarding timing and conditions.

[Stratosfearsome]

CMC

Well that explains the unreasonably slow pace and complete failure in planning regarding timing and conditions.

Hey man, that seems pretty unfair- CMC does tons of good work.