The problem here is unlike other signed dangerous areas (Kirk couloir, backside of Crestone Needle) there isn’t a single point of entry. It would probably be difficult to choose a place for it as people can be lured into McCoy gulch from various parts of the ridge.Gulf_Coast_Hiker wrote: ↑Mon Aug 01, 2022 7:12 pm If this McCoy Gulch is so bad and makes for a lot of rescues, why don't they post this area as "Do Not Enter". Maybe they already have? Maybe the sign wouldn't last that long up there? Just seems like something proactive to stop people from going down there would help. I realize you could definitely miss the sign in bad weather or at night.
I understand that the maps and guidebooks say that already, but that is a big assumption to make that everyone out there does their proper homework before hitting the trails.
Missing hikers on Mount Shavano & Tapeguache
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Re: Missing hikers on Mount Shavano & Tapeguache
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Re: Missing hikers on Mount Shavano & Tapeguache
Yes figured something like that. Thanks for the info!bunny256 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 01, 2022 7:52 pmThe problem here is unlike other signed dangerous areas (Kirk couloir, backside of Crestone Needle) there isn’t a single point of entry. It would probably be difficult to choose a place for it as people can be lured into McCoy gulch from various parts of the ridge.Gulf_Coast_Hiker wrote: ↑Mon Aug 01, 2022 7:12 pm If this McCoy Gulch is so bad and makes for a lot of rescues, why don't they post this area as "Do Not Enter". Maybe they already have? Maybe the sign wouldn't last that long up there? Just seems like something proactive to stop people from going down there would help. I realize you could definitely miss the sign in bad weather or at night.
I understand that the maps and guidebooks say that already, but that is a big assumption to make that everyone out there does their proper homework before hitting the trails.
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Re: Missing hikers on Mount Shavano & Tapeguache
here we go againGulf_Coast_Hiker wrote: ↑Mon Aug 01, 2022 7:12 pm If this McCoy Gulch is so bad and makes for a lot of rescues, why don't they post this area as "Do Not Enter".
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Re: Missing hikers on Mount Shavano & Tapeguache
There are so many things wrong with this sentence, but it is truly symbolic of the coddling of the american mindGulf_Coast_Hiker wrote: ↑Mon Aug 01, 2022 8:38 pm I understand that the maps and guidebooks say that already, but that is a big assumption to make that everyone out there does their proper homework before hitting the trails.
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Re: Missing hikers on Mount Shavano & Tapeguache
Lol this 100%dan0rama wrote: ↑Tue Aug 02, 2022 8:47 amThere are so many things wrong with this sentence, but it is truly symbolic of the coddling of the american mindGulf_Coast_Hiker wrote: ↑Mon Aug 01, 2022 8:38 pm I understand that the maps and guidebooks say that already, but that is a big assumption to make that everyone out there does their proper homework before hitting the trails.
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Re: Missing hikers on Mount Shavano & Tapeguache
AVOID MCCOY GULCH!!! AVOID MCCOY GULCH!!! That’s how my very first 14ers climbing guide from Borneman and Lampert began the description of their routes up Shavano and Tab. That was written 30 years ago but it still keeps happening. It’s been almost 25 years since I’ve been up there and don’t remember if I was tempted by McCoy when descending but I still find myself looking toward it when driving up Monarch Pass and it appears to be pretty ugly. I’ve often wondered if a properly equipped canyoneering team would find it difficult. Surely somebody has made it to the bottom.
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Re: Missing hikers on Mount Shavano & Tapeguache
I vaguely remember someone taking canyoneering gear and doing it properly at one point. Partially to show people what was down there.JChitwood wrote: ↑Tue Aug 02, 2022 2:15 pm AVOID MCCOY GULCH!!! AVOID MCCOY GULCH!!! That’s how my very first 14ers climbing guide from Borneman and Lampert began the description of their routes up Shavano and Tab. That was written 30 years ago but it still keeps happening. It’s been almost 25 years since I’ve been up there and don’t remember if I was tempted by McCoy when descending but I still find myself looking toward it when driving up Monarch Pass and it appears to be pretty ugly. I’ve often wondered if a properly equipped canyoneering team would find it difficult. Surely somebody has made it to the bottom.
There are a couple of images that show up in a Google image search for McCoy Gulch. They make it look absolutely heinous.
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Re: Missing hikers on Mount Shavano & Tapeguache
Here's a ropewiki page with some beta and context for the photos, but there's really not much out there on this one.Jon Frohlich wrote: ↑Tue Aug 02, 2022 2:48 pmI vaguely remember someone taking canyoneering gear and doing it properly at one point. Partially to show people what was down there.JChitwood wrote: ↑Tue Aug 02, 2022 2:15 pm AVOID MCCOY GULCH!!! AVOID MCCOY GULCH!!! That’s how my very first 14ers climbing guide from Borneman and Lampert began the description of their routes up Shavano and Tab. That was written 30 years ago but it still keeps happening. It’s been almost 25 years since I’ve been up there and don’t remember if I was tempted by McCoy when descending but I still find myself looking toward it when driving up Monarch Pass and it appears to be pretty ugly. I’ve often wondered if a properly equipped canyoneering team would find it difficult. Surely somebody has made it to the bottom.
There are a couple of images that show up in a Google image search for McCoy Gulch. They make it look absolutely heinous.
A few friends and I were looking into doing this a few summers ago but ended up not going because we didn't want to haul all our gear up and over Pt. 13,936 and couldn't find any reliable beta about rumored routes up "Zeus ridge" (to McCoy's west; see SP link here) or the route up the opposite side of the falls we were talking about here.
Re: Missing hikers on Mount Shavano & Tapeguache
We didn't know any of this when we (intentionally) descended McCoy once upon a time. We made it down to 10,700' before we realized it didn't go, but we managed to traverse out to the east around 11,000', mainly because I had a GPS with contours.
You pass through rocky narrows well before it turns technical, and "You need rope to descend this way" might have been enough to send us 1,000+ feet back up over the ridge instead of trying to snowshoe down a canyoneering route. That will rob some parties of adventure, but if the goal is to prevent SAR calls, a(n avalanche-proof) sign mounted in the narrows would probably achieve it.
You pass through rocky narrows well before it turns technical, and "You need rope to descend this way" might have been enough to send us 1,000+ feet back up over the ridge instead of trying to snowshoe down a canyoneering route. That will rob some parties of adventure, but if the goal is to prevent SAR calls, a(n avalanche-proof) sign mounted in the narrows would probably achieve it.