Missing Hiker Capitol Peak 7/31

[Rollie Free]

My condolences forbthis terrible tragedy.

To put numbers in perspective:
In 2020 seven 14er fatalities for 415,000 summits (CFI). Thats 1 in 60,000.
USA covid deaths were 1 per 500. More than a hundred times worse.
I knew 2 friend of friends who perished on 14ers over several decades.
I personally knew 5 who died of covid.
One of these I feel much safer- climbing 14ers.

I don't mean to be insensitive (sorry for your losses) but what alternate reality are you living in where US covid deaths are 1 out of every 500?

the reality where 618,000 people out of a population of approximately 300 million have died of COVID. that's about 1 out of 500.

Nothing is that cut and dried, especially in these highly politicized times. Only in 6 percent of cases is Covid stated as THE cause of death. The rest are co-morbitities. Given the absolute vanishing of influenza reporting I would be cynical of even that.

[constipated_pete]

I don't mean to be insensitive (sorry for your losses) but what alternate reality are you living in where US covid deaths are 1 out of every 500?

the reality where 618,000 people out of a population of approximately 300 million have died of COVID. that's about 1 out of 500.

Nothing is that cut and dried, especially in these highly politicized times. Only in 6 percent of cases is Covid stated as THE cause of death. The rest are co-morbitities. Given the absolute vanishing of influenza reporting I would be cynical of even that.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/index.htm

[catfish hank]

Only in 6 percent of cases is Covid stated as THE cause of death. The rest are co-morbitities

Love to see where you got that data. Please cite peer guided literature or medical group that makes this claim.

[HikesInGeologicTime]

FYI: https://www.aspentimes.com/news/injured ... -incident/

Ugh, this is awful. If anyone knows of a Go Fund Me page or other site for collecting donations to help with this woman's medical bills, please post it here.

This is awful, but I am really glad she’s on the (long, painful, frustrating) way to recovery - I wasn’t full of high hopes after reading that she needed to be flown all the way out to Denver after her fall when Aspen has such a great hospital.

I’d also be interested to know if any donations pages pop up. I’m in a similar position of being in the midst of a months-long recovery from a fall (in Capitol’s neighborhood, no less), and while I’m lucky that my insurance is picking up the tab for everything, not everyone can say the same.

[Rollie Free]

Only in 6 percent of cases is Covid stated as THE cause of death. The rest are co-morbitities

Love to see where you got that data. Please cite peer guided literature or medical group that makes this claim.

Per the CDC.
Although many interested parties are trying to dispel it. I've been through the process of the death certificate. Obviously, they don't do autopsies often so its left to the discretion of the physician who signs it.
They are going off a best guess based on medical history. Its a lot messier fact wise than a lot of people imagine it to be.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/health_po ... 20-508.pdf

[TomPierce]

Only in 6 percent of cases is Covid stated as THE cause of death. The rest are co-morbitities

Love to see where you got that data. Please cite peer guided literature or medical group that makes this claim.

Per the CDC.
Although many interested parties are trying to dispel it. I've been through the process of the death certificate. Obviously, they don't do autopsies often so its left to the discretion of the physician who signs it.
They are going off a best guess based on medical history. Its a lot messier fact wise than a lot of people imagine it to be.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/health_po ... 20-508.pdf

This is obviously off topic, but the issue of Covid reporting is of interest to me. Some claim the death rate is inflated, others speculate the contrary. I'm not a physician, but I am a regulated professional (attorney). I mention that because if anyone thinks a doctor will wilfully misstate a cause of death, they need to understand that such a doctor does so at the risk of losing his/her medical license. You can't just make it up one way or another, doing so is at peril of losing the ability to practice, an incredibly heavy penalty. Mistakes no doubt happen, but deliberate misstatements? Eh, doubt it. Fwiw, I thought the attached article laid out some of the uncertainty that Rollie mentions:

https://coloradosun.com/2020/05/15/colo ... rtificate/

-Tom

OK, back on topic!

[Trotter]

Only in 6 percent of cases is Covid stated as THE cause of death. The rest are co-morbitities

Love to see where you got that data. Please cite peer guided literature or medical group that makes this claim.

Per the CDC.
Although many interested parties are trying to dispel it. I've been through the process of the death certificate. Obviously, they don't do autopsies often so its left to the discretion of the physician who signs it.
They are going off a best guess based on medical history. Its a lot messier fact wise than a lot of people imagine it to be.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/health_po ... 20-508.pdf

That is interesting. But it doesn't mean that only 6% of them died of covid. It just means your typical person has a lot of health conditions at any time. Especially true for old people. The vast majority of elderly people have several of these listed conditions but aren't dying from them, if properly treated. But it still has to be listed in this report.

No different if then your grandpa died of covid and he happens to have arthritis. His death certificate could still list his arthritis as an "All other conditions". And according to your logic of using this table, that means he didn't die of covid (as one of the 6%). But I think you'd agree it wasn't the arthritis that killed him. It was covid.

Also notice that the vast majority of "All other conditions and causes" are things like: pneumonia, Adult respiratory distress syndrome, Respiratory failure unspecified, Acute respiratory failure, asphyxia. Covid attacks the respiratory system. So its pretty likely those conditions are probably covid related.

[timisimaginary]

i'm really sorry for contributing to this thread devolving into another covid argument. time to lock this down, delete some posts, and get back to the original topic of focus here.

[Rollie Free]

Love to see where you got that data. Please cite peer guided literature or medical group that makes this claim.

Per the CDC.
Although many interested parties are trying to dispel it. I've been through the process of the death certificate. Obviously, they don't do autopsies often so its left to the discretion of the physician who signs it.
They are going off a best guess based on medical history. Its a lot messier fact wise than a lot of people imagine it to be.

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/health_po ... 20-508.pdf

That is interesting. But it doesn't mean that only 6% of them died of covid. It just means your typical person has a lot of health conditions at any time. Especially true for old people. The vast majority of elderly people have several of these listed conditions but aren't dying from them, if properly treated. But it still has to be listed in this report.

No different if then your grandpa died of covid and he happens to have arthritis. His death certificate could still list his arthritis as an "All other conditions". And according to your logic of using this table, that means he didn't die of covid (as one of the 6%). But I think you'd agree it wasn't the arthritis that killed him. It was covid.

Also notice that the vast majority of "All other conditions and causes" are things like: pneumonia, Adult respiratory distress syndrome, Respiratory failure unspecified, Acute respiratory failure, asphyxia. Covid attacks the respiratory system. So its pretty likely those conditions are probably covid related.

I just related what the CDC reported. It isn't my 'logic. Frankly my cynicism is directed towards pretty much anything I read anymore.