Grays and Torrey parking tickets

[Bill G]

If you read the ordinance those red tickets are notices. You have 24 hours to remove your car.

Or, you can leave a notice on your windshield and then you have 72 hours.

[BillMiddlebrook]

If you read the ordinance those red tickets are notices. You have 24 hours to remove your car.

Or, you can leave a notice on your windshield and then you have 72 hours.

Are those red tickets what people are receiving? I have yet to actually see an image of someone's "ticket".

[James2015]

No, sorry, they've been ticketing, not giving notices. I've been up twice recently (both times parked at I-70) and seen tons of tickets on cars. Ones I saw had $81 dollar fine, or court appearance if you want to fight it. Again, some of the cars were pulled fully off the road, and parking at the good-sized area at the Y split for Grizzly (plenty of room) are ticketed as well.

[speth]

STEVENS GULCH ROAD VISITOR MANAGEMENT ANALYSIS

People have played fast and loose for years with parking along the road, blocking cars and hundreds of other people at times because it was inconvenient to walk a few extra miles in search of the perfect social media photo.

Just like other places in the state - Maroon Bells, Mt Evans, Indian Peaks Wilderness, Rocky Mountain National Park, Hanging Lake, Ice Lake - crowds have used and abused the areas, the response is to crack down, and make these places "pay to play". I think it's too bad, but it's kind of a sign of the times.

I'd personally be in favor of closing off the road entirely above the parking lot at I-70 and encourage people to hike the way up similar to South Colony Lakes has limited access to that area (without eliminating it altogether). But at the same time, I feel like Grays and Torreys, and Bierstadt especially, can be served up as sacrificial lambs to the masses coming out of the front range, if that means that more pristine areas farther away are kept open and better preserved for more responsible use.

[Scott P]

Again, some of the cars were pulled fully off the road, and parking at the good-sized area at the Y split for Grizzly (plenty of room) are ticketed as well.

If someone was parked fully off the road and outside the county right of way, it would be illegal for the county to ticket anyone parked there since it is outside their juridiction. Usually the County ROWs don't extent much beyond the top of slope or top of slope catch points. To fight it though, you would need to look at the row maps for that location (which should be public record). You don't happen to have a picture by chance?

If you are fully off the road , but still within county right of way, they could still ticket you.

[justiner]

I don't think we'll ever see the road fully closed off as there's quite a few properties up there, right up to the summer trailhead.

[daway8]

Got up there 4:30am this morning (Mon, July 5) and got one of the last spaces available at the trailhead. Left at 8:30am (after doing Kelso) and there were a bunch of cars parked next to the abundant No Parking signs near the trailhead (enough to make the road 1 way traffic for a few car lengths).

Didn't yet see any tickets on any windshields but also no cars at all along the road coming up (as seen on many previous occasions) except right by the trailhead. Not sure if that's because not everyone has the Monday after the 4th off or if people were too tired from doing fireworks or if the recent ticketing is having the desired effect, but it sure was nice to not have to barely squeeze through endless rows of cars on either side of the road.

I also did notice a tow truck parked at the lower 2WD trailhead when I was on my way up. Not sure if he got any "business" today or if that was just a deterrent...

There are surely various ways to deal with the parking issues at this over-loved trailhead...

[ekalina]

I personally feel that keeping the road open to regular use (i.e., not SAR/emergency vehicles) is becoming unworkable, for the reasons speth mentioned. But, a compromise solution could be to put up no parking signs in areas along the road where it isn't safe, and allow parking (within reason!) in places where the road is wide enough. Stiff fines for folks who violate - people will learn if the enforcement is consistent.

Edit: I was not aware that there's residences up there, as Justin reported. In that case, a closure wouldn't work. All the more reason to add parking zones where it's reasonable to do so.

[TomPierce]

Clear Creek County has IMO a...liberal(?) interpretation of traffic laws. I'm not saying these tickets are illegal, they sound posted & legit, but many years ago CCC had a 15mph zone in Idaho Springs. Sort of a short stretch, not well posted. I got a ticket there and then sent a written demand to them that they produce the special zone finding which is required under Colorado law to have a zone less than 20mph on a public road. I forgot how that turned out, it was like 20-25 years ago, but it was the most blatant speed trap I've ever seen. To Bill's earlier comment, the G&T ticketing sounds like just a revenue generator, beware.

-Tom

[seano]

This sounds like a blatant cash grab, but I'm not sure what the solution is to this overcrowding. Sometimes it's easy -- closing Zion canyon to cars and operating a free shuttle is great, and I hope they do the same to Yosemite Valley. Maybe they could do something similar using a park-n-ride along I-70, or have a Grays 'n' Torreys permit lottery like they do for Whitney. "Sign up here to climb the 12th- and 14th-highest peaks in the lower 48!"

EDIT:

... many years ago CCC had a 15mph zone in Idaho Springs. Sort of a short stretch, not well posted. I got a ticket there and then sent a written demand to them that they produce the special zone finding which is required under Colorado law to have a zone less than 20mph on a public road. I forgot how that turned out, it was like 20-25 years ago, but it was the most blatant speed trap I've ever seen.=

Wow, that's even worse than the 25mph sign at the base of Molas Pass in Silverton! I had a blast watching a cop parked on the dirt road across from the gas station ticket a dozen or so people in an afternoon.

[Urban Snowshoer]

This sounds like a blatant cash grab, but I'm not sure what the solution is to this overcrowding. Sometimes it's easy -- closing Zion canyon to cars and operating a free shuttle is great, and I hope they do the same to Yosemite Valley. Maybe they could do something similar using a park-n-ride along I-70, or have a Grays 'n' Torreys permit lottery like they do for Whitney. "Sign up here to climb the 12th- and 14th-highest peaks in the lower 48!"

It doesn't even have to come to a climbing permit lottery--just having a lottery or reservation system for parking spaces at the trailhead and ticketing those who park outside of it would probably do the trick.

[James2015]

[/quote]

If someone was parked fully off the road and outside the county right of way, it would be illegal for the county to ticket anyone parked there since it is outside their juridiction. Usually the County ROWs don't extent much beyond the top of slope or top of slope catch points. To fight it though, you would need to look at the row maps for that location (which should be public record). You don't happen to have a picture by chance?

If you are fully off the road , but still within county right of way, they could still ticket you.
[/quote]

Nope, no pic unfortunately. I felt bad for some of the ticketed, they'd squeezed every last bit of space between the road and dropoff to get fully off. There was no legitimate way of saying they were blocking access. I was just along the South Platte (97) this weekend, and they've done a good job at marking parking areas that had adequate space to pull off -- they should do that on the road and then ticket anyone who is blocking access and not parked in signed areas. If they're not willing to do that, then this is just a cash grab and antagonizes the public.