Colorado Wolves Reintroduction

[planet54]

Here you go. With video.
https://www.skyhinews.com/news/colorado ... -underway/

[rmcpherson]

Some great footage. Gorgeous animals. Direct link to the release video:

[montanahiker]

i'm more inclined to point my finger at golf courses and lawn watering, but you are absolutely correct- commercial ag isn't helping the situation either

Again, alfalfa alone accounts for 30% of water usage in Colorado according to the Colorado Sun, municipalities account for 7% of water usage. I'm not sure why you wouldn't point your finger at alfalfa growers. Commercial ag is the person sitting on I-70 complaining about the traffic. You ARE the traffic, man.

I'm not sure why you would point your finger at the people producing food. If anyone in agriculture, however you want to label them to make yourself feel superior, is complaining about the water usage of municipalities for lawns and golf courses they are much more justified than the other way around.

[nyker]

I wonder if the Colorado Cattlemen’s and Gunnison County Stockgrowers’ Associations would also like to see an environmental impact assessment conducted on the “environmental consequences" to the planet's rising temperature as a result of raising cattle. The loss of a handful of livestock from wolf reitroduction would no doubt be a net benefit.

according to the USDA, there are "29.4 million beef cows in the United States as of July 1, 2023"
according to The Nature Conservancy, "It is estimated that 30 million bison were wandering the plains when Columbus landed on the eastern shores."

anyway..

I'm confused as to what the point of this is?

Parsing comments from others, but I think the original point trying to be made (right or wrong) was related to the potential linkage of climate change to livestock/cattle farming (methane production presumably since that's a GHG) - and that apparently the current tally of cattle roughly approximates the number of bison in precolumbian times, thus the second poster is refuting the assertion of the first that there is an impact on climate change due to methane gas from cattle...-speculating of course...in this deep quagmire of a topic.

[Matt]

Look. We don't need these kind of scenes at our Colorado ski resorts (unless it thins out the lift lines)

[greenonion]

according to the USDA, there are "29.4 million beef cows in the United States as of July 1, 2023"
according to The Nature Conservancy, "It is estimated that 30 million bison were wandering the plains when Columbus landed on the eastern shores."

anyway..

I'm confused as to what the point of this is?

Parsing comments from others, but I think the original point trying to be made (right or wrong) was related to the potential linkage of climate change to livestock/cattle farming (methane production presumably since that's a GHG) - and that apparently the current tally of cattle roughly approximates the number of bison in precolumbian times, thus the second poster is refuting the assertion of the first that there is an impact on climate change due to methane gas from cattle...-speculating of course...in this deep quagmire of a topic.

Well put. But what??

[greenonion]

I'm confused as to what the point of this is?

Parsing comments from others, but I think the original point trying to be made (right or wrong) was related to the potential linkage of climate change to livestock/cattle farming (methane production presumably since that's a GHG) - and that apparently the current tally of cattle roughly approximates the number of bison in precolumbian times, thus the second poster is refuting the assertion of the first that there is an impact on climate change due to methane gas from cattle...-speculating of course...in this deep quagmire of a topic.

Well put. But what??

Speculative for sure, as I was earlier. But well put, I think.

[two lunches]

Look. We don't need these kind of scenes at our Colorado ski resorts (unless it thins out the lift lines)

the fact that i voted no on this proposition had absolutely nothing at all to do with this movie



but i do think about it *every single time* i am on a chair lift.

[BerkeleyBuff]

This line from the article sums it up pretty well:

Most people in the counties with the strongest support for Proposition 114 — Boulder with 68% and Denver with 66% — probably won’t encounter a wolf

Personally I think the wolves should also be reintroduced at the Pearl Street Mall and LoDo. If they love the wolves so much, let them roam around there.

Man I really wish I had a dollar for every time this moronic statement gets repeated on the internet.

[BerkeleyBuff]

Not being irrational. Fear of wolves is ingrained in all of us through fairytales and media. This fear will be compounded exponentially in the state given the historic relationship with wolves (irradication) and the polarizing politics that wolves have in the state (the map from the news story). It takes just one time, one incident, and an entire community in Colorado could be devastated. This isn't Northern Michigan or Minnesota or Wisconsin. An easy Google search shows Colorado's second biggest industry is tourism. Wyoming's total GDP is $36 billion...Colorado's tourism is $25 billion. We are not comparing apples to apples or even apples to applesauce here. Tourism doesn't crack the Top 5 in those above Midwest states. What if a pack of wolves attacks an Instagram model trying to feed them Doritos at Turquoise Lake? Non-mountain residents feed crap to all of the critters all of the time or try to get well timed filter selfies with critters and pay the price. What fallout will take place in Lake County because of a tourist and cheese dusted tortilla chips? Do you remember the impact the coyote attack at Copper Mountain had on the resort after a couple tried to feed it a PBJ? The mountains are not just lift lines and grumpy ranchers. Maybe Michigan, Wisconsin, and Minnesota would have more tourism without wolves? Correlation doesn't imply causation argument can go a lot of ways.

Werewolves in London of American origin, Big Bad Wolf, Liam Neeson hunting wolves, Twighlight, Disney's Zombies, etc. Wolves create fears that go back millenia. Google search what Jaws or any shark attacks have done to beach towns.

I don't own livestock or have pets. I have a child and we explore the woods everyday. I live in a town that is EXTREMELY dependent on tourism. The world isn't all accepting of a wolf attack like we think they should be. We accept bear attacks and rattlesnakes; they were sick or hurt or the human messed up with food or poking or getting too close. Other than stoned bears or Leo's SD grizzly, bears steal your picnic basket or are distracting costumes to local Vermont Police officers and we laugh in the media. Wolves are Jurassic Park raptors that can only be killed by a silver bullet. These perceptions are true and real in our culture.

Should the solution be to educate the masses of people that land at DIA every hour with a video of what not to do once you drive past Red Rocks? Wolves are fine in the upper Midwest or Wyoming because because because...could this be different? This experiment will be interesting to watch unfold.

I don't understand the point to this argument at all, unless you're going to argue Colorado should immediately seek to eliminate all mountain lions and black bears from the state; both are MUCH more likely to attack you or your kid (and both are still exceptionally rare). If the whole argument is "people will be afraid of wolves..." well, so what? People are morons, and they also think bears are goofy clumsy critters that just raid your picnic. I've seen far too many a Wyoming tourist turn their back to a bear for a selfie.

Wolves are pretty damn far down the list of animals you should be terrified of. They're shockingly shy. (I'm a biologist who spends about 100 days a year out in wolf territory and have been within ten feet of them in the wild on quite a few occasions).

[interloper]

This line from the article sums it up pretty well:

Most people in the counties with the strongest support for Proposition 114 — Boulder with 68% and Denver with 66% — probably won’t encounter a wolf

Personally I think the wolves should also be reintroduced at the Pearl Street Mall and LoDo. If they love the wolves so much, let them roam around there.

Man I really wish I had a dollar for every time this moronic statement gets repeated on the internet.

I was being facetious. But I stand by my contention that this was a ballot initiative written by, and largely approved by, people who have absolutely zero skin in the game.

What if rural Colorado originated and helped approve a ballot initiative forbidding new construction anywhere along the I-25 corridor in an effort to ‘preserve and help restore a natural balance of habitat’? Would that be fair? This is what I’m getting at here.

I don’t care about wolves. They’re not going to personally affect my livelihood or even my hobbies. My issue is with how we got here.

[LURE]

Not being irrational. Fear of wolves is ingrained in all of us through fairytales and media. This fear will be compounded exponentially in the state given the historic relationship with wolves (irradication) and the polarizing politics that wolves have in the state (the map from the news story). It takes just one time, one incident, and an entire community in Colorado could be devastated. This isn't Northern Michigan or Minnesota or Wisconsin. An easy Google search shows Colorado's second biggest industry is tourism. Wyoming's total GDP is $36 billion...Colorado's tourism is $25 billion. We are not comparing apples to apples or even apples to applesauce here. Tourism doesn't crack the Top 5 in those above Midwest states. What if a pack of wolves attacks an Instagram model trying to feed them Doritos at Turquoise Lake? Non-mountain residents feed crap to all of the critters all of the time or try to get well timed filter selfies with critters and pay the price. What fallout will take place in Lake County because of a tourist and cheese dusted tortilla chips? Do you remember the impact the coyote attack at Copper Mountain had on the resort after a couple tried to feed it a PBJ? The mountains are not just lift lines and grumpy ranchers. Maybe Michigan, Wisconsin, and Minnesota would have more tourism without wolves? Correlation doesn't imply causation argument can go a lot of ways.

Werewolves in London of American origin, Big Bad Wolf, Liam Neeson hunting wolves, Twighlight, Disney's Zombies, etc. Wolves create fears that go back millenia. Google search what Jaws or any shark attacks have done to beach towns.

I don't own livestock or have pets. I have a child and we explore the woods everyday. I live in a town that is EXTREMELY dependent on tourism. The world isn't all accepting of a wolf attack like we think they should be. We accept bear attacks and rattlesnakes; they were sick or hurt or the human messed up with food or poking or getting too close. Other than stoned bears or Leo's SD grizzly, bears steal your picnic basket or are distracting costumes to local Vermont Police officers and we laugh in the media. Wolves are Jurassic Park raptors that can only be killed by a silver bullet. These perceptions are true and real in our culture.

Should the solution be to educate the masses of people that land at DIA every hour with a video of what not to do once you drive past Red Rocks? Wolves are fine in the upper Midwest or Wyoming because because because...could this be different? This experiment will be interesting to watch unfold.

I don't understand the point to this argument at all, unless you're going to argue Colorado should immediately seek to eliminate all mountain lions and black bears from the state; both are MUCH more likely to attack you or your kid (and both are still exceptionally rare). If the whole argument is "people will be afraid of wolves..." well, so what? People are morons, and they also think bears are goofy clumsy critters that just raid your picnic. I've seen far too many a Wyoming tourist turn their back to a bear for a selfie.

Wolves are pretty damn far down the list of animals you should be terrified of. They're shockingly shy. (I'm a biologist who spends about 100 days a year out in wolf territory and have been within ten feet of them in the wild on quite a few occasions).

i can assure you, don't bother with that one.