As far as press coverage, you already got an article out of the Colorado Springs paper. And the author/reporter, if you noticed, is a poster on here and posted his article. Me thinks you just might get a second story with the turn of events here.
hahahaha... I like the idea to rename the town "Kit Carson City" - wouldn't that mitigate earlier supposed wrongdoings??!?
Petition to rename Kit Carson
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Re: Petition to rename Kit Carson
As entertaining as that might be, it would also be a distraction and only serve to dilute the message.DeTour wrote:Plus if you're really concerned about news coverage, you know it would help get the point across if we voted to rename the town. You know how those things work in the media.
I would start it, but I don't have the resume. It needs your gravitas.
My *only goal* is to ensure that a petition filed with the BGN, by a reporter out of Crestone, to rename Kit Carson to "Mount Crestone" and its summit "Tranquility Peak," isn't passed (a) without full disclosure as to the actual intents behind the recommended changes and (b) without those most likely having an interest in the decision being made aware of it, and having the opportunity to voice their opinions for or against it. That's democracy.
I have my own opinions, which I've already voiced here, pretty clearly. The "influencers" - the CMC, Forest Service, local government etc. - have already weighed in as well, with the BGN. And I'm writing a letter myself to the Board on Geographic Names, which I may post here at some point.
If anyone would like to voice their own opinion directly to the BGN, this is probably a good time to do that. So again, here is that contact info:
The GNIS Manager: gnis_manager@usgs.gov
Thank you... and gravitas out. Now time for more fun. It *is* good!
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Re: Petition to rename Kit Carson
Then quit whining and complaining, wasting tax dollars on stupid initiatives like this... Tackle something important. (removing Culebra from the grip of the almighty dollar for example).Keno Menechino wrote:mountainrev wrote:Yes, the mountain belongs to everybody, but it is the locals who live in Crestone who maintain the trails in our nearby mountains, including Kit Carson Mountain. It is our local Search and Rescue people (using our local tax dollars) who risk their lives up on this mountain, who heed the call of duty when somebody gets lost, hurt, or killed up on that mountain. When people from outside of town want to climb the mountain, us locals are the ones they ask about the conditions. As the town's official weather observer and record keeper, I've have many climbers ask me how the conditions are up there, and in the last several years I have talked a few of them from climbing the mountain in October and November because of dangerous conditions which they didn't know about.I believe Colorado's epic 14ers belong to more than just the communities that are closest to them. In a very real sense, they belong to all of us (which is why many get upset over the private ownership and closed access to peaks like Culebra). Thus, IMHO, it's a bit presumptuous for a small community like Crestone to feel that they are the only ones enlightened enough to name these peaks.
One person a year on average dies up on that mountain and each time this happens our small community feels the pain along with the families affected by the lost. Too bad none of you who post here feel our pain with the mountain being called by the wrong name for 100 plus years, and clearly, none of you understand the long running confusion caused by this problem. Like I already said, it's Crestone up against the entire world once again.
I am sorry, but I must agree with Mountain Rev above. The mountains of Colorado belong to all of us. I dont care if I am walking on one, or flying over (as I so frequently do), they touch me. To me it is a simple aspect of "nothing else matters" and clouding this up by complaining about a stupid name, wasting tax money doing so, and "rallying" a community is absurd. At least the historical accuracy of the names exists. If you want to go on a crusade about something, why dont you get school teachers to quit teaching Christoper Colombus discovered America? Or that Hitler was the largest mass murderer? I mean seriously. Find something important. I do not want to be raising my children in a world where everything is so unbelievably puckered, the PC police are the only ones allowed to voice an opinion.
To me, if anywhere near the amount of effort gone into changing the name, complaining about changing the name, starting a petition to change the name, starting a petition against changing the name, and all the other senseless bs went toward education and safety around the mountain, the time would be so much better spent!
My $.02 (and dont be the smartass telling me to keep it

-Just as soon as you idiot proof something, some a**hole is just going to come along and make a better idiot.
-To Cessna: "November one, zero, four Lima Papa, wind 080 at 90 peak gusts 120, runway 35 cleared for takeoff"
To fellow controller: "Watch this sh!t"
-Whether climbing or flying, the single greatest thing to remember is that every ascent is optional, and if you feel like making another, your subsequent descent is mandatory.
-To Cessna: "November one, zero, four Lima Papa, wind 080 at 90 peak gusts 120, runway 35 cleared for takeoff"
To fellow controller: "Watch this sh!t"
-Whether climbing or flying, the single greatest thing to remember is that every ascent is optional, and if you feel like making another, your subsequent descent is mandatory.
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Re: Petition to rename Kit Carson
are you sure that your mountain rescue team is using tax dollars?
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Re: Petition to rename Kit Carson
OK, I get it from Susan's last post. This is a serious enough matter to not mess around with renaming Crestone, no matter how amusing the notion. So I emailed BGN, both opposing the "Crestone" name and supporting making "Kit Carson Peak" the official name for the primary peak of Kit Carson Mountain, instead of the proposed "Tranquility Peak."
I was surprised to receive not just one, but two responses within a few off-business hours on a holiday weekend. A staffer named Jennifer Runyon acknowledged the counter-proposal (submitted by Fred Bauder) to make official the name "Kit Carson Peak": We will add your name to the list of those who support applying the name "Kit Carson Peak" and thus rejecting the earlier proposal for "Tranquility Peak".
It seems to me that supporting the Fred Bauder proposal to make "KIt Carson Peak" the official name lends strength to the argument against renaming the entire massif. Plus that "Tranquility Peak" nonsense has no semblance of history behind it, not even the disputable history cited by the "Crestone" supporters.
I still want to rename the town of Crestone to Kit Carson City, but I guess that will have to wait for another day.
I was surprised to receive not just one, but two responses within a few off-business hours on a holiday weekend. A staffer named Jennifer Runyon acknowledged the counter-proposal (submitted by Fred Bauder) to make official the name "Kit Carson Peak": We will add your name to the list of those who support applying the name "Kit Carson Peak" and thus rejecting the earlier proposal for "Tranquility Peak".
It seems to me that supporting the Fred Bauder proposal to make "KIt Carson Peak" the official name lends strength to the argument against renaming the entire massif. Plus that "Tranquility Peak" nonsense has no semblance of history behind it, not even the disputable history cited by the "Crestone" supporters.
I still want to rename the town of Crestone to Kit Carson City, but I guess that will have to wait for another day.
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Once torched by truth, a little thing like faith is easy.
Swede Landing, 'Peace Like a River'
The land is forever.
- Steve Almburg, Illinois centennial farmer
Once torched by truth, a little thing like faith is easy.
Swede Landing, 'Peace Like a River'
The land is forever.
- Steve Almburg, Illinois centennial farmer
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Re: Petition to rename Kit Carson
Thank you, you engaged in effective action.DeTour wrote:OK, I get it from Susan's last post. This is a serious enough matter to not mess around with renaming Crestone, no matter how amusing the notion. So I emailed BGN, both opposing the "Crestone" name and supporting making "Kit Carson Peak" the official name for the primary peak of Kit Carson Mountain, instead of the proposed "Tranquility Peak."
I was surprised to receive not just one, but two responses within a few off-business hours on a holiday weekend. A staffer named Jennifer Runyon acknowledged the counter-proposal (submitted by Fred Bauder) to make official the name "Kit Carson Peak": We will add your name to the list of those who support applying the name "Kit Carson Peak" and thus rejecting the earlier proposal for "Tranquility Peak".
It seems to me that supporting the Fred Bauder proposal to make "KIt Carson Peak" the official name lends strength to the argument against renaming the entire massif. Plus that "Tranquility Peak" nonsense has no semblance of history behind it, not even the disputable history cited by the "Crestone" supporters.
I still want to rename the town of Crestone to Kit Carson City, but I guess that will have to wait for another day.
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Re: Petition to rename Kit Carson
I am about to formally express my opposition to the first two proposals, and my support of officially naming the highest point "Kit Carson Peak." However, I'm confused about the suggestion to send my opinion to "gnis_manager@usgs.gov," as The Quarterly Review List states that comments should be sent to "BGNEXEC@usgs.gov." To be safe, I'll send it to both addresses.
Until DeTour gets his petition going to rename the town of Crestone "Kit Carson City," we can all simply start calling it Kit Carson City. The good citizens of Kit Carson City have set a precedent that it is appropriate to call any place whatever you wish, regardless of the official or commonly used name. As in: "I've never been to Kit Carson City, but I look forward to visiting the town when I climb Kit Carson Peak on Kit Carson Mountain."
Several years ago I visited Kit Carson's home in Taos, NM. The tour guide was a part-Indian descendent of Carson's family, who had no animosity toward Carson and had no problem putting his story in its proper historical perspective.
Until DeTour gets his petition going to rename the town of Crestone "Kit Carson City," we can all simply start calling it Kit Carson City. The good citizens of Kit Carson City have set a precedent that it is appropriate to call any place whatever you wish, regardless of the official or commonly used name. As in: "I've never been to Kit Carson City, but I look forward to visiting the town when I climb Kit Carson Peak on Kit Carson Mountain."
Several years ago I visited Kit Carson's home in Taos, NM. The tour guide was a part-Indian descendent of Carson's family, who had no animosity toward Carson and had no problem putting his story in its proper historical perspective.
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Re: Petition to rename Kit Carson
Thanks DeTour, it *is* serious. If there was only a silly petition with those 104 signatures, or the appeal from Keno - a marketing guy from Manitou Springs who moves to Crestone and is suddenly thrown into convulsions with the "pain of a hundred years" - I wouldn't even have started this thread. None of that could be taken seriously.DeTour wrote:OK, I get it from Susan's last post. This is a serious enough matter to not mess around with renaming Crestone, no matter how amusing the notion. So I emailed BGN, both opposing the "Crestone" name and supporting making "Kit Carson Peak" the official name for the primary peak of Kit Carson Mountain, instead of the proposed "Tranquility Peak."
But this is being backed by the Mayor, two out of three of the County Commissioners, and the entire City Council. And Keno has even invoked the local search and rescue as being supporters of this name change. The Board on Geographic Names will be taking all that into account, and they will have to give it all serious consideration.
I still haven't figured out how all these folks could back such a ridiculous proposal. It just doesn't make sense. $eriou$ly, what'$ in it for the$e people? I gue$$ we'll never know the an$wer to that que$tion.
I would like to know, from the one Saguache County Commissioner who rejected the name change, why he didn't go along with it. And if he knows why everyone else did.
And I can't help but wonder how people might react if the city and county governments of Denver or Colorado Springs moved to change the names of Longs Peak or Pikes Peak. I think there would be quite an uproar. Sadly, Kit Carson is kind of an orphan among 14ers, and just doesn't have the built-in fan base that comes with being situated near a densely populated metropolis.
I like your idea of supporting Fred's counter-proposal, while denouncing Keno's proposal. I will do the same. Thanks for the excellent idea!
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Re: Petition to rename Kit Carson
If anyone would like to communicate their opinion to the BGN *opposing the name change* and *making official* the Kit Carson Peak moniker, and is struggling for the right words, please feel free to copy and paste my own email to that authority, below. You can edit it as you see fit, or simply use it intact, and in its entirety. Again, the email address is: gnis_manager@usgs.gov As edhaman noted, you may also send your comments to: BGNEXEC@usgs.gov but I'm pretty sure they all end up in the same place. Thanks!
Dear GNIS Manager,
In regard to the subject of renaming Colorado 14er Kit Carson Mountain,
I’d like to voice my *DISAPPROVAL* for the following proposal:
The proposal to name the massif "Mount Crestone" and the highest point "Tranquility Peak," proposed by Keno Menechino.
I’d like to voice my *SUPPORT* for the following proposal:
The proposal to name the highest point on the massif "Kit Carson Peak," proposed by Fred Bauder.
The reasons behind my opinion on the matter are many-fold, but can be summed up as follows:
• Thousands of hikers and recreationists know this peak as “Kit Carson,†and changing the name will create a lot of confusion in the climbing community, and among the many search and rescue organizations that are called upon from across the state in times of emergency.
• There are thousands of maps, websites, guide books and trip reports that currently reference this peak as “Kit Carson†and the owners of those documents should not be expected to incur the time- and cost-intensive expense of changing their collateral.
• The argument that the peak’s namesake, “Kit Carson,†is a war criminal and unworthy of tribute is debatable, especially considering the political environment and national interests of the times.
• Specifically, there is no historical or political reason – in fact, there is no reason at all - for naming the summit “Tranquility Peak,†and indeed, I’m struggling to understand how a reporter from the town of Crestone should be allowed the honor of naming a 14er at all.
Thank you in advance for taking my opinion into consideration, in your final decisions on these matters.
Best regards,
<Insert signature>
Dear GNIS Manager,
In regard to the subject of renaming Colorado 14er Kit Carson Mountain,
I’d like to voice my *DISAPPROVAL* for the following proposal:
The proposal to name the massif "Mount Crestone" and the highest point "Tranquility Peak," proposed by Keno Menechino.
I’d like to voice my *SUPPORT* for the following proposal:
The proposal to name the highest point on the massif "Kit Carson Peak," proposed by Fred Bauder.
The reasons behind my opinion on the matter are many-fold, but can be summed up as follows:
• Thousands of hikers and recreationists know this peak as “Kit Carson,†and changing the name will create a lot of confusion in the climbing community, and among the many search and rescue organizations that are called upon from across the state in times of emergency.
• There are thousands of maps, websites, guide books and trip reports that currently reference this peak as “Kit Carson†and the owners of those documents should not be expected to incur the time- and cost-intensive expense of changing their collateral.
• The argument that the peak’s namesake, “Kit Carson,†is a war criminal and unworthy of tribute is debatable, especially considering the political environment and national interests of the times.
• Specifically, there is no historical or political reason – in fact, there is no reason at all - for naming the summit “Tranquility Peak,†and indeed, I’m struggling to understand how a reporter from the town of Crestone should be allowed the honor of naming a 14er at all.
Thank you in advance for taking my opinion into consideration, in your final decisions on these matters.
Best regards,
<Insert signature>
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Re: Petition to rename Kit Carson
Thanks, Susan! Sent!
Re: Petition to rename Kit Carson
+1
Sent - thanks Susan.
Sent - thanks Susan.
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Re: Petition to rename Kit Carson
Just a guess, but Tranquility might come from the moon or astronaut theme they have going... "Sea of Tranquility" on the Moon. Colombia and Challenger points nearby... Just a thought.