Info on gear, conditioning, and preparation for hiking/climbing.
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Altitude High wrote:I'd like to hear of others' experiences with minimalist footwear. For now, I'm talking only about in relatively snow-free conditions, such as in summer or early fall.
Instinctively I've wanted to switch to minimalist shoes for some time. One of my worst experiences was when I wore my five-pound Vasque hiking boots up a 14er. I'm considering something like the Vibram FiveFinger. Especially on the upper approaches, I'd feel much more comfortable with my foot in close contact with the surface.
You seem to be talking extremes here between 5lb boots and Five Fingers. In between these two, there are literally hundreds of options in the categories of lighter hiking boots, trail runners, "hiking shoes" and then the true minimalist shoes.
Unless you have a specific need for a flat unsupported minimalist shoe on a mountain, you should check out hiking/approach footwear from the dozen or so popular makes. When there is no snow, I usually wear a low cut Merrell or North Face shoe which have been great. I also have used 3 season hiking and approach shoes from Asolo and Scarpa which are good too. These all weigh from 1-2 lbs per pair, not heavy at all. I have Sportiva Bushidos but I have not climbed a mountain in them though they are comfortable to wear as a "minimalist" shoe.
If you opt for minimalist shoes, unless you normally wear flat unsupported minimalist shoes, I would put some miles on them before spending a day up and down a mountain, as your feet and body need to get used to them gradually, similar to the old barefoot running idea. Ease into it or else your feet and body will pay for it.
strayster2 and I were just having a similar conversation the other day. I told him I was looking at getting one of these for harder climbs (link below), and he suggested going barefoot "to complete the outfit" http://www.cilice.co.uk/hairshirts/sack ... osary.html
Similarly, you could go for the complete ensemble and get a matching loincloth.
I tried to ride the minimalist wave a number of years ago. In my experience it just wasn't the best option for extended hiking on terrain other than a good trail.
I had/have a pair of the 5-fingers. I now have a busted up hammer toe, too. The shoes were comfortable, but took some getting used to on long treks. As a side note, I was wearing near-zero drop running shoes for most activities so my feet weren't starting from scratch.
The pros: Comfortable. GREAT feel for the trail! As close to wearing nothing as you can get. Even more so than sandals. Excellent traction and control. Made for great scrambling or climbing. Surprisingly, the padded toe protection prevented easy toe injury. Crossing water was a breeze and no water log if they're drenched. Obviously, super lightweight. Nice in warm or summer conditions. Great around the campfire!
The cons: Pointed rocks = OUCH! And they can't compensate for getting foot trapped in narrow voids. You really have to pay attention on difficult terrain as there is no forgiveness for a misstep. Good luck trying to outrun a thunderstorm! Talus or large stones could result in serious injury. No protection over top of foot. If wet for a long time your feet are going to get cold and stay cold. Think Trench foot. Also, they tend to make my feet sweat quite a bit. That gets stinky.
What forced me out of them was the liability. After several near disasters with rocks rolling over my foot, I opted out of the potential SAR effort and switched back to more traditional footwear. Over time I definitely did more damage to my feet than I would have with wearing a harder shoe. This didn't add up for me. Depending on my excursion, I now wear either very lightweight runners (about half pound) or my Salomon hiking boots which only weigh about 2 lbs. The added safety of the boots is very comforting. As we all know a foot injury can be a serious issue in the back country... especially if you're solo. Its the cascade affect of the injury that can kill you.
If you're so concerned about the added weight of a boot on your foot you better reconsider climbing mountains as a viable hobby. I figure if I'm not capable of "lugging" those boots up a mountain I'm not worthy of the endeavor. So, choose your footwear wisely. Don't take advice blindly. Everyone is different so whatever works for you. What works for you is all that matters. I guess if I wanted to be completely minimalist and one-with-nature I can hike naked and barefoot. But that wouldn't end well.
Last edited by mtree on Mon Jan 14, 2019 1:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.
- I didn't say it was your fault. I said I was blaming you.
Ever try running for cover from impending storms over loose talus with sandals on? Good times. Try trail runners with vibram. Dynafit Feline Vertical are clutch for scrambling and running. The Mutants are okay too. Don’t be sold on a shoe just because of superior marketing perpetuated by local athletes.
Traveling light is the only way to fly.
IG: @colorado_invasive
Strava: Brent Herring
I have run at times in minimalist footwear (even barefoot on very smooth terrain), but hiking mountains is a different story for me.
I am not a big heavy boots kind of guy, but I do like a well built hiking shoe with a good stiff toe for all of those times that I accidentally kick a rock.
Other climbers are probably not as clumsy as I am and might do fine.
I would recommend trying to run in a shoe before you climb in it. If it is too minimalist to run in, then it is probably too minimalist to climb in.
Sean Nunn
"Thy righteousness is like the great mountains." --Psalms 36:6
RichH wrote:I've done my last 20 14ers in trail running shoes (Hoka Speedgoat 2) and an Ultra Vest. I have one pair of Scarpa 3lb hiking boots for winter climbs and crampon use, and everything else is lightweight.
I like the Hokas because they are light, I can run much of the trail and they have enough cushioning that my feet feel great - even after a 25 mile day. Not sure how much cushioning the Vibram Five Fingers would provide after walking on rocks all day.
How are the Speedgoats re: draining / drying? Would they be a good choice for those that chose to wade through water crossings (with shoes on) vs. rock-hopping and log crossings?
mtree wrote:What forced me out of them was the liability. After several near disasters with rocks rolling over my foot, I opted out of the potential SAR effort and switched back to more traditional footwear.
There have been several threads about this issue over the years. I laughed, then and now, how many peeps could look past the risk of totally mangling your foot with a stray large rock while wearing these idiot-conceived shoes.
Mountain = Large Pile of Moving Rocks.
Feet= Large collection of small, delicate bones, with little casing around them.
Mountain > Feet
Hospital = Place where the above relationship is clearly understood.
Bank = Place where money is withdrawn to pay for said understanding.
Oh, one more thing: those five fingers STINK worse than any shoe I have ever come in contact with. Another big plus for them.
Call on God, but row away from the rocks.
Hunter S Thompson
Walk away from the droning and leave the hive behind.
Dick Derkase
I also wear Altra Lone Peak shoes. I had s pair of 1.0 and now I'm wearing the 4.0. I love them. I wore themon my 300 mile hike of the Arizona Trail in 2018 and wear them on all my hikes. I am a fan. I consider them to be a minimalist shoe. I have done lots of hiking in Chaco's but don't do that anymore.
"There's a feeling I get when I look to the West and my spirit is crying for leaving" Led Zeppelin
RichH wrote:I've done my last 20 14ers in trail running shoes (Hoka Speedgoat 2) and an Ultra Vest. I have one pair of Scarpa 3lb hiking boots for winter climbs and crampon use, and everything else is lightweight.
I like the Hokas because they are light, I can run much of the trail and they have enough cushioning that my feet feel great - even after a 25 mile day. Not sure how much cushioning the Vibram Five Fingers would provide after walking on rocks all day.
How are the Speedgoats re: draining / drying? Would they be a good choice for those that chose to wade through water crossings (with shoes on) vs. rock-hopping and log crossings?
Honestly I don't know. I think there are better models (e.g. the Mafate) if you are going to wade through rivers. In more than 1500 miles running in Speedgoat 2s I've never actually soaked them. I've gotten rained on, ran in mud and stepped in water briefly, but never had to wade a river. There is a new waterproof mid-height Speedgoat 3 that I was going to try out on 14ers this summer.
mtree wrote:What forced me out of them was the liability. After several near disasters with rocks rolling over my foot, I opted out of the potential SAR effort and switched back to more traditional footwear.
There have been several threads about this issue over the years. I laughed, then and now, how many peeps could look past the risk of totally mangling your foot with a stray large rock while wearing these idiot-conceived shoes.
Mountain = Large Pile of Moving Rocks.
Feet= Large collection of small, delicate bones, with little casing around them.
Mountain > Feet
Hospital = Place where the above relationship is clearly understood.
Bank = Place where money is withdrawn to pay for said understanding.
Oh, one more thing: those five fingers STINK worse than any shoe I have ever come in contact with. Another big plus for them.
One thing you have to like about HighPilgrim: you always know exactly what he is thinking about any issue.
Sean Nunn
"Thy righteousness is like the great mountains." --Psalms 36:6
highpilgrim wrote:There have been several threads about this issue over the years. I laughed, then and now, how many peeps could look past the risk of totally mangling your foot with a stray large rock while wearing these idiot-conceived shoes.
Before all the rocks comes mostly dirt. Take Lone Eagle as an example. I wore sandals the first ~ 7 miles and switched to rock shoes for the last 0.5 miles. By the time there was any danger whatsoever of getting hospitalized by some rock, I was ready to put my rock shoes on. So I was super comfortable and happy for the whole trip. Personally, I wouldn't have been nearly as happy on the approach or on the climb with approach shoes or hiking boots. And I never put myself at any risk. Maybe a mountain goat could have dislodged a huge boulder from 200ft above me and crushed my foot? But then maybe my foot would have been crushed inside of a shoe too, or maybe the boulder would have crushed my unprotected hand instead.
JaredJohnson wrote:
Before all the rocks comes mostly dirt. Take Lone Eagle as an example. I wore sandals the first ~ 7 miles and switched to rock shoes for the last 0.5 miles. By the time there was any danger whatsoever of getting hospitalized by some rock, I was ready to put my rock shoes on. So I was super comfortable and happy for the whole trip. Personally, I wouldn't have been nearly as happy on the approach or on the climb with approach shoes or hiking boots.
Not trying to change your mind, Jared. You wear whatever you feel comfortable with. I just want to provide a different opinion/data point: I did the hike in, hike out, and downclimbed Solo Flight on Lone Eagle Peak all with just a pair of approach shoes, and I was totally happy. I probably could've done the hike in and hike out in my Chaco sandals, but once you leave the trail at Crater Lake and before you get on the class 4 stuff near the end, the steep hiking on grass, dirt, and loose rock in between is where I would have problems with either sandals/flip flops or climbing shoes. Stuff like the photo below:
