Fitness for older athletes - advice needed

[LarryM]

This is kinda specific, and maybe not something that you guys can help me with without knowing much more about me. First, the background: I'm 66 years old, I like to do big days in the mountains. Not super technical stuff, just long days doing up to class 2+. I am a trail runner, and train pretty intensively, mixing running on the flat, runnable vert, and fast hiking steeper vert. Yesterday I did Halo Ridge with a friend. Here's the issue: We went clockwise, and summited Holy Cross Ridge in about 6 1/2 hours. Not super fast, but decent considering our ages & the terrain. All we had left was the traverse to Holy Cross & the descent on the main trail. Probably should have taken another 4 hours, but instead it took 6, because I got really tired and slowed down considerably (one curious side note on this: I did manage the 2 remaining uphill sections (Holy Cross itself and Half Moon Pass) fairly quickly, it was the downhill stuff where I was absurdly slow). Not sure what went wrong:

-nutrition & hydration? Often an issue for me, but I thought I had that covered pretty well yesterday.

-lack of acclimatization? Maybe, but I live near Boulder, and this was the 5th time this year above 11,000 feet, all pretty recently.

-need to hit the gym more? I do need this, but I don't see this helping much with this specific issue.

-balance? Definitely been an issue as I get older, and was an issue yesterday. But not sure how best to address this at my age.

-just getting older? Well yeah, but I know several guys my age or older who still can manage big days in the mountains without getting super fatigued.

-relative lack of long distance training? In the past couple of years I've cut back a bit on longer days (last year partly due to 2 injuries), but have been working my way back lately (2 18 miles runs and 2 15 mile runs in the past 4 weeks, all with decent vert, albeit not in the high alpine).

-something else?

Thoughts? what do the most accomplished mountain athletes my age do to continue to do big days in the mountains?

[SkaredShtles]

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[nyker]

Bit of a head scratcher, since seems you are fit enough being a trail runner and running at altitude often. You mention injuries, maybe you've been overtraining? Assume you wear a HRM to monitor?

Can't ignore age, but don't think that's it alone given your activity level. Have you had any recent change of lifestyle over the last several months, sleep changes, added stress in your life? Those things add up over time and have a way to take the steam out of your fitness sails...

A few years back I was feeling the same, and after 2-3 months of just not feeling right, but no discernable reason and two "clean bill of health" conclusions from two different Doctors let me feeling more confused. Upon going to a third Dr, she was very quick and, I discovered I had a lingering sinus infection that said was clear as day, which I didn't even realize. After that was taken care of within ten days, the dull headache and lethargic feeling went away and I literally was like a new person. Maybe you have some underlying infection insidiously sapping you.

[Jorts]

All we had left was the traverse to Holy Cross & the descent on the main trail. Probably should have taken another 4 hours, but instead it took 6, because I got really tired and slowed down considerably (one curious side note on this: I did manage the 2 remaining uphill sections (Holy Cross itself and Half Moon Pass) fairly quickly, it was the downhill stuff where I was absurdly slow).

I'm 44 so you have a few years on me but wondering, what did you experience that slowed you down? General fatigue? Specific muscular fatigue?

[ekalina]

Do you think this discussion on muscular endurance might apply?
https://uphillathlete.com/strength-trai ... -athletes/

Particularly this part, since you mentioned the downhills being the issue:
"Neglecting the downhill is another consistent gap, particularly for trail runners. The eccentric demands of sustained descending are a separate and trainable quality, and athletes who focus exclusively on uphill ME work may arrive at their goal event with strong uphill legs and quads that fall apart on the descents. Both the concentric and eccentric components belong in the program."

[greenonion]

Larry. I’m somewhat how you describe yourself, but not identical. Am 62, closer to 63. Sounds like you are doing quite well overall, especially given that route. I’m guessing it’s more age and nutrition, possibly hydration too. I’m trying to figure some of this out too. Looking forward to hearing, well… hearing SOME responses on this.

Sorry I’m not giving concrete advice Larry, but I am learning after 60 that a different reinvention of oneself is a good option.

[cedica]

-balance? Definitely been an issue as I get older, and was an issue yesterday. But not sure how best to address this at my age.

If you can rule out inner ear issues and neurological problems (God forbid), then loss of flexibility is the probable cause, and you can definitely try to do something about it. Stretching, yoga or chair yoga, then more stretching after. Neck stretches and exercises could help a lot because, especially at our advanced age , neck stiffness is the most likely culprit for balance issues not caused by above mentioned medical conditions.

[cottonmountaineering]

i think nothing to worry about, it's pretty normal to get slow if you're on a route above treeline for most of the day and a person of average fitness living in the front range. more training/exposure to altitude fixes it.

this exact same thing happens to me if im not training, i like to save the long days above treeline more towards the end of summer as my fitness is usually better

[Wentzl]

I was thinking of posting here for the same question.

65 years old, getting slower beyond my years.

Hikes that took 4 hours taking 8 and my head spinning and feeling like I am dying.

Just normal aging, or something that can be overcome?

I take blood pressure medicine and think that may be part of the problem. Tweeked the dosage and content over the years with varying results. Still a prime suspect for my lack of endurance these past few years. But overcoming injuries is a compounding factor that makes it hard to figure out.

I would like to hear from the senior group here, and discount jackass responses like that from skardshtles.

Anyone over 60 who has found second wind, chime in please.

[DArcyS]

I just turned 60, and I bike race competitively. I took up bike racing about ten years ago, making peak bagging a secondary activity that I pursue in the off-season (namely the fall).

For the Iron Horse (Durango to Silverton) bike race this year, I finished 6th out of about 80, so I do okay for myself (although the guys behind would probably say I do better than just "okay"). I'll note the guy who won this year for M60+ is 66, the guy who won last year for M60+ was 70, and the guy who finished 5th in front of me this year is 68.

Here's my general observation/theory: Once one passes 60, what you did in your younger years becomes critical in terms of retained fitness. But it's not the volume that's important, rather it's the amount or quality of intensity performed.

So, I have close view of elite racers who are still bike racing in their 60s (a couple of guys I race against raced the Tour de France in their 20s), and they did incredible intensity when they were younger. Consequently, they still have game.

In contrast, I have the sense that the fitness decline for peakbaggers is a little bit steeper. Yes, avid peak baggers will accumulate plenty of volume, but I don't think many peak baggers work in intervals on their climbs. To be sure, a peak bagger's fitness is better than that of the sedentary crowd, but I don't think it can compare with those who pushed their cardiovascular system.

A little more anecdotal evidence. A couple years ago, three of my high school buddies attempted Denali. They all trained in the short term, but the guy who made the summit had spent decades playing hockey and had a decade of training to run races behind him.

A couple years ago, I summited Peak Ten (the new lidar peak) with a man and woman in their 70s. The fellow, who was a runner, was plenty fast. The woman, a little slower, but she summited. Back when she was younger, she ran half marathons.

Specifically addressing LarryM's issue, getting older is probably the primary issue. Maybe a little can be done, like being fully rested before a big hike (i.e., treating a big hike like a race where one tapers the amount of training to ensure one is fully rested). Otherwise, what is done has already been done, and there's not much that can be done to change the past. In my opinion...

[LarryM]

Thanks for all of the responses. To engage with some of the responses that most resonate:

-the flexibility comment regarding balance hits home; I am not very flexible. Need to work on that.

-I don't think I'm overtraining per se, but I did do an 18 mile run 2 days prior. That may have been a factor.

-on the other hand, the early season comment resonated. Yes, I've done some stuff up high recently, but this was my first big day up high this year. My prior biggest day at elevation this year was Bierstadt, less than half the distance and vert, and on a far easier trail.

-I do need to take another look at downhill training. I tell myself that I get it organically (what goes up must come down), but I am dramatically stronger on the uphill than on the downhill.

-upon reflection, I probably was a little short of nutrition. This was especially an issue for the initial descent from Holy Cross; it took 2 hours to get below tree line, at which point we fueled up again & my pace quickened.

-I've never been really strong on class 2+ terrain; I'm probably not going to be able to fix that at my age. Probably my biggest prior day doing this much sustained class 2+ terrain was Mummy kill. Other big days up high were on mellower terrain, e.g., Guenella pass to Grays & Torreys, Loveland pass to Grays and Torreys, Audubon-Paiute-Toll-Pawnee, etc.

-and, yes, some of it is just the inevitable passage of time. Not to humble brag, but there just aren't THAT many people my age doing really big days in the high mountains at all. e.g., while I am sure that I am far from the first person my age to do Halo Ridge, I am the first person in my age group (65-70) to get credit for the relevant clockwise segment on Strava.

[seannunn]

I can only tell what has worked and not worked for me, and I am "only" 58, so take it with a grain of salt.
When I was young, all I did for training was run. Then I would just come out to Colorado and knock out peaks just using 3:00 marathon fitness.
Now that I am 58 I don't have 3:00 marathon fitness, so I have to be much more focused in my training towards climbing.

Specificity is important; I found that out last fall. I didn't do any "longer" hikes (10+ miles) last year to prepare for climbing.
The result of that was that I suffered pretty bad on Snowmass (9 miles on day 1, then 15 on day 2).
As others have said, interval training is good because it raises your ceiling. I can't access any real mountains in MO, so I find the steepest long hill that is close and go up and down it 15-30 times with an oversized/overweighted pack. Yes, it's boring in a way, and it's hard, but it works better than if I just hiked at 80% level effort all the time.
I do 1 leg stands on a balance device (a wobbly platform that you have to struggle to maintain balance on). That helps. To me that is important as I get older; I don't want to lose my balance on an exposed part of a mountain.
Having stronger legs will reduce fatigue. If you really want to go crazy you can do eccentric leg training (leg extensions where you bring your legs down real slowly), since that is what you do on a descent. Be careful with those, they can make you really sore. A little goes a long ways.

Hope some of this helps. Keep in mind that slowing down some is inevitable as you get older, sorry to say.

Sean Nunn
Peculiar, MO